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Post by Rob Hanesworth on Oct 22, 2014 21:39:32 GMT -5
I think maybe I support the busker's right to busk on a public transportation train platform but I am arguing with myself about how strong my support is.
From here in my recliner in Indiana my support is pretty strong. If I am on the narrow train platform in New York at rush hour with 237 other people and the guy and his guitar case are impeding my progress to my exit and the dinner meat loaf my loving wife has prepared is getting cold in my third floor walk-up two blocks away, my support for the busker weakens considerably. And if I support the right of one guitar player to be there, how do I feel about two guitar players, or a guitar player, a cellist, a sousaphone player, and a guy with a portable pump organ, who of course needs a chair to sit on?
It can start to get crowded on the platform and I may be about to talk myself into supporting requiring buskers to get permits, just to thin the herd.
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Post by epaul on Oct 22, 2014 23:04:00 GMT -5
Cop tells you to move, you move. The guy is lucky he didn't get tasered and cuffed (my connection quit, if he did get cuffed, he deserved it). If you have a point, establish it later on with your lawyer at the precinct. The cop should have just ignored the situation or resolved it quickly, cuffing the guy when he ignored a direct police order. It never should have dragged on as long as it did. Ignore or enforce, don't debate with the clowns.
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Post by mnhermit on Oct 23, 2014 7:25:49 GMT -5
Hey he's lucky he's still alive - these are the same yahoos that put 47 bullets into a guy going for his wallet. As a busker I'm not arguing with the guys with guns whatever their uniform.
besides a law suit for restraint of trade and free speech is much more profitable, might even be able to open up his own venue with the proceeds.
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Post by Marshall on Oct 23, 2014 8:07:21 GMT -5
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Post by Marshall on Oct 23, 2014 8:08:02 GMT -5
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Post by dradtke on Oct 23, 2014 8:49:18 GMT -5
... the Metropolitan Transportation Authority's rules of conduct that says artistic performances and solicitations of donations are allowed. But the MTA rules differ from state law, which says an entertainer can be arrested for loitering in a transportation facility unless he was authorized to be there. If there's a discrepancy between state law and the MTA's rules, which one takes precedence?
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Post by epaul on Oct 23, 2014 9:23:25 GMT -5
If the legal situation is as described in that paragraph, there is no discrepancy. If the MTA says performances are allowed (and no other conditions are specified or need to be met), that should pass muster as a blanket authorization.
I don't know why the cop stopped and asked the guy to move. Could be he was being an overly officious dick, or there could be a legitimate reason that wasn't made clear in the story or the video. Regardless, once the cop does issue a direct order, rightly or wrongly, he does represent a legal authority, and arguing with a cop and refusing his direct order to move along is asking for trouble. If you want trouble, fine, go for it. Once in a very great while, the trouble may achieve a greater purpose.
Cops act appropriately, cops make mistakes, but cops can't function if every request or action they take is met with non-compliance and a twenty-minute debate about what the law really means. Ignore or enforce, don't dither in front of the peanut gallery. Good teachers, officers, and cops know this.
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Post by Lonnie on Oct 23, 2014 10:42:44 GMT -5
... the Metropolitan Transportation Authority's rules of conduct that says artistic performances and solicitations of donations are allowed. But the MTA rules differ from state law, which says an entertainer can be arrested for loitering in a transportation facility unless he was authorized to be there. If there's a discrepancy between state law and the MTA's rules, which one takes precedence? I think we need to look at the definition of "loitering." By definition, the guy was not loitering... playing Neil Young songs might be considered littering.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 23, 2014 11:22:06 GMT -5
The cop reads out the law that explicitly states that what the busker is doing is not an offence (1'40"ish) and in due course arrests him. WTF? Evidently there are already 15 lawsuits for wrongful arrest of buskers by NYPD. I read somewhere that the cost to taxpayers of the settlements may be in six figures. So all in all, in time, it might not turn out to have been such a bad day at the office for the understandably exasperated singer.
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Post by Marshall on Oct 23, 2014 12:31:52 GMT -5
. . . , Evidently there are already 15 lawsuits for wrongful arrest of buskers by NYPD. I read somewhere that the cost to taxpayers of the settlements may be in six figures. So all in all, in time, it might not turn out to have been such a bad day at the office for the understandably exasperated singer. Hey, this seems like a success story for musicians. Great way to make a buck. (certainly can't make any money being allowed to play)
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Post by Lonnie on Oct 23, 2014 12:59:09 GMT -5
Biff Rose once said that he registered a copyright on a 4 bar rest, so he would get paid whenever anyone wasn't playing music.
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