My reply to Arch's appeal to us...

[loopysanchez]

I don't know if any of you have read it or not, but Arch posted what to me looks like a last-ditch appeal to those who are departing the forum, along with some heavy rationalization of his own behavior. I posted a reply to it, which you're welcome to lurk on over there and see at:

DELETED IN CASE THEY CAN TRACE IT...


Or heck, I'll just repost the text of my response here:



Arch, I figure I'm due to put in my honest 2 cent's worth on this subject. I ask you to resist the urge to reply back with anger, and will read this as an honest opinion coming from someone who has nothing to gain either way in any of this:

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I urge you not to punish one another for the actions of the few people that you do not like.
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For the most part It's not the people I don't like, it's their behavior. Any dislike for the people themselves has come from the fact that I know they are capable of behaving in a normal, civilized manner when they choose to, but the "thrill of the fight" often turns them into something ugly and unrecognizable.


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Why don't all get together and start a fully moderated forum with strict rules that strictly prohibits and excludes the behaviors disapprove of. Set out a clear set of strict rules and delete any post that breaks them.
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It sounds like you're attempting to justify the behavior of certain people based on the fact that there weren't rules in place that strictly forbid it. I really hope that's not the case.


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AG members send the rough an tumble people here. This forum is set up for rough and tumble. A lot of people came here with that expectation.
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I don't think anyone came over here with that expectation. An expectation of political debate without one-sided censorship from a ruling body of NoCal Lefties, perhaps , but not an expectation that people could treat each other like $hit and act like they'd done nothing wrong because there weren't rules written down stating you couldn't act that way.


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If you just want a nice, quiet, polite, watercooler forum. You need to design it that way from the start. That's the only way to be fair to each and every member. Tell them what to expect from the start and there won't be any battles over expectations of personal behavior.
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It sounds like you're saying it's either nice and quiet, or anything goes, including personal insults, condescention, mischaracterizations, and personal vendettas. And any attempt to create something in between the two extremes, rather than being originally designed to the nth degree to codify what most folks consider to be common sense and common courtesy is just not being fair to each and every member. That's what I'm hearing from you.


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This forum can go back to being lightly moderated. The restriction on Anonymous posting can go away. I think we owe that to d28. The misfits who are looking for a home can stay here. The people who want something beyond what the rules of this place can provide will have what they want.
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The thing is, with the exception of the Riddler's brief posting spree, most of the abuses that led to this came from registered posters. I don't see where the yes/no debate on anonymous posting ranks anywhere near the top of the list of reasons this exodous happened. Not on my list, anyway. And I don't think anybody necessarily wants anything beyond the rules of this place. Heck, we shouldn't need anything beyond the rules of this place. It's only a select few people who are oblivious to what constitutes civilized behavior that they would need to have anything else spelled out for them beyond the basic "keep it friendly" directive offered in this forum.


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That place could send the rough and tumble people here. When someone who is here yearns for quiet and sedate friendship. He or she could go to the other place.
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You use the words "Rough and Tumble" and "Quiet and Sedate" , but I suspect "Rough and Tumble" means, "People are free to be complete a-holes to anybody who disagrees with them, without fear of reprimand", and "Quiet and Sedate" means "Everybody will be bored to death because they can't do what the 'Rough and Tumble' folks get to do." I hope I'm wrong, but fear I'm not.

That's my last word on the subject.

[Dan McLaughlin]

I just read it loop.

Good post and thanks.

[Deleted]

TTT seems to be rather slow today. I posted my last Music Page last night (a day early) with a note to anyone counting me among their friends that they know where to get in touch with me.

I have this visual in my mind.... rundown old wooden structures, winds, dust, a few tumbleweeds, and the only sounds being some rusty old hinges and/or maybe a windmill. Kinda sad but not too sad.

[Gypsy Picker]

There is certainly some navel gazing going on right now, but only Strick seems to understand what's really happened. Arch and Ethel appear to be clueless -- not only about the exodus, but about their pivotal role in it.

[SteveO]

I'm a Newbie.....If Welcome Cool, if not That's OK to....

It was Arch's post that showed me where you all swam to

[guitone]

Welcome steveo....

[SteveO]

Thank You for the Welcome

[Supertramp78]

Welcome SteveO! Pull up a chair.

[Supertramp78]

Maybe Arch needs to remember what he posted on the 19th.

"VI, Sehkmet, Shannon, Millring and Cornflake, Whoever else. If you want a private club you should start one. Lots of folks might join. You can make it invitation only. You can start your own board of moderators and make all the rules you want. I wouldn't even be opposed to Paul putting a sticky on the top of this fourm for you to recruit new blood.

But this isn't your forum. This is the forum for the banned. Some of us need this forum. If you don't. If y'all want to just hang out with like minded people, religously, politically, whatever. You should go start your own."

[sekhmet]

truly, it is Arch's overbearing assumption of authority that boiled my blood. Nice of him to suggest that we start a new forum, and how gracious of him not to oppose a sticker put up by someone else to point the way. He even set out the format. How thoughtful. He tried it again today, until Strick put a pin in his balloon. I suspect that Strick is really enjoying his old rival going on at an empty room. He's finally got him.

I boiled about this for a long time. Not good. I'm so relieved to be here, but it took me a long time to get mad and it will take some decompression.

[SteveO]

supertramp78 said:

Welcome SteveO! Pull up a chair.

I would Like to say " Thank You " Tramp

[paulschlimm]

Possibly we could make this place as fun as TTT was when I found it if we make a conscious effort here to quit talking about how much fun TTT used to be when I found it and what a drag it turned into? Just a thought before we muddy the carpets here with too much introspection.....?

Musica, peeples! MUUUUUsica!

Paul

[Deleted]

I couldn`t agree more Paul.

[Doug]

Good plan Paul, I don't want to talk about TTT or the split. Onward and upward.

[Deleted]

Today i made up with Arch, Ethel and Headache. I`m glad I did. I felt really bad talking behind their backs. I apologised, they accepted. It felt good. I want to be friends with anyone who wants to be friends with me. Which is why I joined here. Many good friends here and at TTT.

[paulschlimm]

Matt,

Remember, friends don't let friends go thirsty.

Paul

[billhammond]

That was very classy, Matt. Karma points to you ...

[Deleted]

Paul,
I`ll shout you the drink if you provide the airfare..Deal?

Bill,
Thanksyou.
I felt I needed to do it. I felt bad that I was so catty behind their backs. I`m only judging my own actions when i say that. I`m happy that they took it well.
Oooh 2 Karma points!!!

[billhammond]

In the same spirit, I have renamed my posting handle here, which also takes me back to zero posts. I feel so skinny!

[Deleted]

Ahh but I see you now have one Karma point for being..well..for being you...kisses! Had to say that because for the first time we have a kissing emoticon.