Dub
Administrator
I'm gettin' so the past is the only thing I can remember.
Posts: 19,910 
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Post by Dub on Jul 25, 2017 19:48:09 GMT -5
Here is Glenn's Facebook post from earlier today: You can follow this on FB if you want. Within an hour of posting, Glenn reported that the NYT had the article on line. Here's the link. www.nytimes.com/2017/07/25/us/boy-scouts-trump-speech.htmlIf you read the NYT piece, you'll see Zach Wahls quoted too. Zach is the son of Dr. Terry Wahl's, someone we know and admire. This really pisses me off. |
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Post by dradtke on Jul 25, 2017 19:55:51 GMT -5
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Post by dradtke on Jul 25, 2017 19:56:46 GMT -5
Cross-posted.
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Post by jdd2 on Jul 25, 2017 20:07:18 GMT -5
I only 'made' Star, maybe a half dozen badges. Scouts was way better than sports. My dad was involved (backroom stuff--money, mgmt) and we had a couple really great leaders (one who I'd really like to find and thank). Camp Wokanda for a week each summer (tents), overnights/weekends at the same in cabins fall & winter, long day hikes of about 20mi now & then, canoeing, and one leader was a pilot (and a cop) and we went flying a couple times. Lots of really great memories. Unlike some other things that may not, I would hope that scouting survives this ever-so-typical instance of trump. |
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Post by Doug on Jul 25, 2017 20:45:55 GMT -5
Only Star here. Moved from MS to FL and it was a whole different scouting program so I stopped going. In MS it was a hard core redneck organization with hunting, shooting and learning "a county boy can survive" stuff. In FL it was sissy.
I don't pay much attention to what politicians say. We had 8 yrs of speeches that could have come out of Lenin and I didn't pay any attention to them either.
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Post by TKennedy on Jul 25, 2017 21:08:55 GMT -5
After seeing his talk this morning confirming what a despicable sack of shit he is the first thought that entered my mind was a Hitler Youth rally.
Later I found I was not the only one.
On the other hand if you ask him to talk you know what you will get. It should not have come as a big surprise. You ain't gettin' no role model.
Way to go Glenn!
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Post by david on Jul 25, 2017 21:34:21 GMT -5
The man has no ethics.
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Post by coachdoc on Jul 26, 2017 5:45:24 GMT -5
WTG, Glenn. No need to toss in the medal though. You earned that through valiant effort. It stands for your effort and beliefs, not his.
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Post by millring on Jul 26, 2017 6:04:27 GMT -5
Interesting opening line. Fake News from the Washington Post: www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2017/07/25/trumps-boy-scouts-speech-broke-with-80-years-of-presidential-tradition/?utm_term=.6f7e741e3e19Trump didn't break 80 years of tradition. Obama did. The opening line says: "For 80 years, American presidents have been speaking to the National Scout Jamboree, a gathering of tens of thousands of youngsters from around the world eager to absorb the ideas of service, citizenship and global diplomacy." But that's not true. Obama broke that tradition. And he did so over politics. He didn't address the jamboree. He phoned in a speech in 2010 but during the Obama years of identity politics, the Boy Scouts were in the outs with the left. Not diverse enough. Too much goddam religion. Not rainbow enough. Too whitebread and militaristic. Trump's speech wasn't given in a vacuum of public sentiment about the Boy Scouts. It was a response to the left's and Obama's spite and derision of it. It's Calvinball. Now the Boy Scouts are a revered tradition and we should honor it. Because it's now a tool to attack a reviled president. So Trump's an oaf. Big news. It wouldn't have mattered what he said. Only the degree of outrage would be different. He's an illegitimate president and everything he says is offensive. I think that much of the discomfort with the speech is in realizing that not everyone hates Trump as much as the press does...and the jamboree showed the press that the press isn't as influential as it thinks it should be with middle America. The thing that has people most upset isn't Trump's speech. No, the thing that has most people upset is the crowd's cheers. The press's outrage proves most of Trump's criticisms of it in the speech. |
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Post by jdd2 on Jul 26, 2017 6:54:24 GMT -5
Interesting opening line. Fake News from the Washington Post: www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2017/07/25/trumps-boy-scouts-speech-broke-with-80-years-of-presidential-tradition/?utm_term=.6f7e741e3e19Trump didn't break 80 years of tradition. Obama did. The opening line says: "For 80 years, American presidents have been speaking to the National Scout Jamboree, a gathering of tens of thousands of youngsters from around the world eager to absorb the ideas of service, citizenship and global diplomacy." But that's not true. Obama broke that tradition. And he did so over politics. He didn't address the jamboree. He phoned in a speech in 2010 but during the Obama years of identity politics, the Boy Scouts were in the outs with the left. Not diverse enough. Too much goddam religion. Not rainbow enough. Too whitebread and militaristic. It's Calvinball. Now the Boy Scouts are a revered tradition and we should honor it. Because it's now a tool to attack a reviled president. So Trump's an oaf. Big news. It wouldn't have mattered what he said. Only the degree of outrage would be different. He's an illegitimate president and everything he says is offensive. I think that much of the discomfort with the speech is in realizing that not everyone hates Trump as much as the press does...and the jamboree showed the press that the press isn't as influential as it thinks it should be with middle America. The thing that has people most upset isn't Trump's speech. No, the thing that has most people upset is the crowd's cheers. The press's outrage proves most of Trump's criticisms of it in the speech. Obviously, you were not in scouting, |
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Post by millring on Jul 26, 2017 6:57:27 GMT -5
Obviously, you were not in scouting, Based on what? I wasn't. But my oldest brother, Bob was an eagle. And my other two older brothers were very involved -- played in the Boy Scout band at a national jamboree in the early 60s (somebody even recorded it and pressed a vinyl that we had back then). My dad was a scoutmaster. |
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Post by drlj on Jul 26, 2017 7:04:17 GMT -5
I wondered how long it would take you, John, to embrace the term "fake news."
The objections that I have read to Trump's speech is that it was political. I listened to it. It was pretty political. It covered the usual Trump topics and even included an interesting cocktail party story.
Obama was not there in 2010 but he did do a video speech. It was not political. No cocktail party stories.
This is Obama's speech. The video is online. Maybe it is a fake video.
Hello everybody.
I wanted to send my greetings to everyone taking part in the national Scout Jamboree at Fort A.P. Hill and congratulate you on the hundredth anniversary of the Boy Scouts of America. I hope you've all enjoyed this year's festivities.
You know, for a century, scouts just like you have served your communities and your nation in ways both large and small. During World War II, scouts played a vital role in supporting the war effort at home by running messages and selling war bonds. Some of our nation's greatest heroes have worn the scout uniform, including 11 of the 12 men who have walked on the moon. And today, scouts across the country continue the tradition of collecting food for those in need, improving our neighborhoods, and reaching out to those less fortunate.
That service is worth celebrating. But there's still more to do. Even though we face a different set of challenges than we did 100 years ago, they are no less important. And in the years ahead, we are going to depend on you, the next generation of leaders, to move America forward.
So I hope that all of you will carry the lesson you have learned in scouting with you for the rest of your lives. And I hope that when you're called upon to help write the next great chapter in the American story, you will uphold the best of the scouting tradition and respond with enthusiasm, skill and determination.
Congratulations again on your first 100 years. I'm sure the next 100 will be even better.
It may or may not have been a great speech. You can criticize him for not being there, I suppose.
I am sure you will find a way to do just that.
I think it was good that Trump was there. I think his speech was pretty awful for the event. Maybe my brain is doing fake thinking.
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Post by millring on Jul 26, 2017 7:22:48 GMT -5
Not embracing anything. Not even defending Trump's speech. Just calling hypocrisy. The press is invoking Hitler, for heaven's sake.
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Post by Marshall on Jul 26, 2017 7:42:57 GMT -5
Interesting opening line. Fake News from the Washington Post: www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2017/07/25/trumps-boy-scouts-speech-broke-with-80-years-of-presidential-tradition/?utm_term=.6f7e741e3e19Trump didn't break 80 years of tradition. Obama did. The opening line says: "For 80 years, American presidents have been speaking to the National Scout Jamboree, a gathering of tens of thousands of youngsters from around the world eager to absorb the ideas of service, citizenship and global diplomacy." But that's not true. Obama broke that tradition. And he did so over politics. He didn't address the jamboree. He phoned in a speech in 2010 but during the Obama years of identity politics, the Boy Scouts were in the outs with the left. Not diverse enough. Too much goddam religion. Not rainbow enough. Too whitebread and militaristic. Trump's speech wasn't given in a vacuum of public sentiment about the Boy Scouts. It was a response to the left's and Obama's spite and derision of it. It's Calvinball. Now the Boy Scouts are a revered tradition and we should honor it. Because it's now a tool to attack a reviled president. So Trump's an oaf. Big news. It wouldn't have mattered what he said. Only the degree of outrage would be different. He's an illegitimate president and everything he says is offensive. I think that much of the discomfort with the speech is in realizing that not everyone hates Trump as much as the press does...and the jamboree showed the press that the press isn't as influential as it thinks it should be with middle America. The thing that has people most upset isn't Trump's speech. No, the thing that has most people upset is the crowd's cheers. The press's outrage proves most of Trump's criticisms of it in the speech. Interesting. But I like Glenn Elvig better. |
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Post by millring on Jul 26, 2017 7:49:13 GMT -5
But I like Glenn Elvig better. Well, duh. How could anyone resist those dimples? |
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Post by jdd2 on Jul 26, 2017 7:51:53 GMT -5
Obviously, you were not in scouting, Based on what? I wasn't. But my oldest brother, Bob was an eagle. And my other two older brothers were very involved -- played in the Boy Scout band at a national jamboree in the early 60s (somebody even recorded it and pressed a vinyl that we had back then). My dad was a scoutmaster. Don't get personal if you don't want to, but with brothers and a father in scouting, how did you miss out on it? |
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Post by millring on Jul 26, 2017 9:21:24 GMT -5
Based on what? I wasn't. But my oldest brother, Bob was an eagle. And my other two older brothers were very involved -- played in the Boy Scout band at a national jamboree in the early 60s (somebody even recorded it and pressed a vinyl that we had back then). My dad was a scoutmaster. Don't get personal if you don't want to, but with brothers and a father in scouting, how did you miss out on it? My dad killed himself when I was 11. |
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Post by millring on Jul 26, 2017 9:33:01 GMT -5
I know this may be hard to understand. Maybe even impossible to understand. After all, I'm the one characterized by Cornflake as the binary thinker -- too dull for complex ideas. And you guys are the intellectual chess players.
And you think I'm saying there's a media conspiracy.
I'm not.
But...
I don't like Trump. I don't want Trump. I wish he had never happened to our political scene. But I also believe that what made Trump possible was this very crap. This demonization of everything remotely Republican. That's what made Trump a possibility. Enough people -- as evidenced by the cheering throng at the jamboree -- are fed up with a few people with GREAT BIG megaphones telling Americans how we think and how awful we are. We're characterized as a basket of deplorables and once you've characterized us as that, there comes a point at which we simply stop listening. That's what created Trump.
And if it wasn't Trump, any other Republican president would be facing the very same hair-on-fire scandal-a-day full frontal assault by the press. I don't have to guess. I lived through the Bush years. I witness the McCain and Romney runs. The same demonization would be happening. Only the names have been changed.
Remember -- with 16 candidates lined up against Trump, you called them all "clowns in a clown car".
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Post by coachdoc on Jul 26, 2017 9:44:32 GMT -5
I agree with most of what you say there, John. But the most attacked and belittled president ever was Obama, not a Republican. The shit is splattered about just like that gorilla in the little swimming pool. We need more thoughtful discourse, much like McCain's speech on return to the Senate.
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Post by millring on Jul 26, 2017 9:51:23 GMT -5
But the most attacked and belittled president ever was Obama, not a Republican. By the press? Where? When? |
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