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Post by drlj on Nov 7, 2017 12:46:49 GMT -5
Not quite the image I was going for, but a distinct possibility.
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Post by AlanC on Nov 7, 2017 13:05:28 GMT -5
If FW insists on traditional burial, I will conspire with my son and Baby Dottir to provide my headstone inscription.
WTF? I Told You I Didn’t Feel Good! (Not original I know but it makes me smile to think about the reaction it would get down here in Bible Land)
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Post by coachdoc on Nov 7, 2017 13:36:06 GMT -5
I scattered my Dad's ashes by the left field wall at Doubleday in Cooperstown, my Mom's in her garden in Dresden, Maine, I enjoy visiting them.
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Post by dradtke on Nov 7, 2017 13:44:52 GMT -5
I had no idea anyone but me even knew who he was. Nice! Steve, a few years ago we worked on a museum in Juneau. The client - also a guitar player - was a fan of Hobo Jim's. He was surprised anyone down here had heard of him.
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Dub
Administrator
I'm gettin' so the past is the only thing I can remember.
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Post by Dub on Nov 7, 2017 14:06:39 GMT -5
Funerals are indeed changing. My father donated his corpse to Des Moines University (formerly Still College), the second oldest osteopathic medical school and the fifteenth largest medical school in the US. There was a large memorial service celebrating his life. More than a year later, when the university had made what use they could of his remains, they had the rest cremated and the ashes were given to my mother in a box. Since they already had a cemetery plot in the little town of Elkhart, IA, where they were from, we gathered there for an interment ceremony and shared memories as we placed the urn in a small hole.
My mother had what I'd call a modern traditional funeral. That is funeral home, casket, visitation one day and funeral service the next with a short burial service at the cemetery in Elkhart.
I say “modern traditional” because funeral practices have changed a great deal over our country's history. Not much more than a hundred years ago a town's furniture maker was also the undertaker. If the town was too small for a furniture maker, it was the wheel right or cooper; whoever had the woodworking skills to make coffins. When someone died their body was washed and prepared for burial by the person's family at home. The body was placed in the new casket for burial and a graveside service was held. They didn't wait three days for burial as the corpse wasn't preserved. If time was needed for family members to travel long distances, there were caskets that had a viewing glass over the face of the deceased allowing the casket to be tightly sealed to prevent vermin from getting access and to contain odors.
People wealthy enough to live in large houses kept a fancy casket in the attic to be brought down to the parlor when someone died. Another “pine box” style casket was made for the actual burial and the fancy display casket was returned to the attic until needed once more.
Fiddlerina and I have made no plans for our eventual demises but it's becoming clear that we need to do that if only so that burden doesn't fall on those we love. Our family has a tradition of visiting grave sites on Memorial Day weekend. We have family members come from as far as California and Connecticut for the event. We make a parade from one small rural cemetery to the next placing potted geraniums at each grave. They've begun referring to it as The Red Geranium Society. We tell well worn stories and remind ourselves about how each was related. Some of the stones go back to the mid nineteenth century. Most of my family is not religious in any sense and some are atheists. It's not about the hereafter. It's more about living family and the great pleasure we all get from just getting together.
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Post by Doug on Nov 7, 2017 14:08:32 GMT -5
The more we talk about it the more I'm liking the coyote & buzzard idea.
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Post by Village Idiot on Nov 7, 2017 14:13:29 GMT -5
Kim used to get calls fairly often for her to make something to bring to a funeral dinner, as all the ladies in the church would do. The visitation would be the evening before, the funeral the next day. First at the church, then a drive to the cemetary then a trip back to the church for the funeral dinner. This is an increasingly rare custom, and I’m quite happy with the modern Celebration of Life.
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Dub
Administrator
I'm gettin' so the past is the only thing I can remember.
Posts: 19,904
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Post by Dub on Nov 7, 2017 14:15:45 GMT -5
The more we talk about it the more I'm liking the coyote & buzzard idea. I think that is the most environmentally friendly approach. It may not seem respectful but it's clean.
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Dub
Administrator
I'm gettin' so the past is the only thing I can remember.
Posts: 19,904
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Post by Dub on Nov 7, 2017 14:19:55 GMT -5
Kim used to get calls fairly often for her to make something to bring to a funeral dinner, as all the ladies in the church would do. The visitation would be the evening before, the funeral the next day. First at the church, then a drive to the cemetary then a trip back to the church for the funeral dinner. This is an increasingly rare custom, and I’m quite happy with the modern Celebration of Life. In some traditions this meal is called the mercy meal. I like the idea of a meal because it gets everyone sitting and talking together. Conversation ranges far from the departed and the idea of death. People catch up with each other and perhaps more importantly share in a feeling of community for a short time.
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Post by Village Idiot on Nov 7, 2017 14:20:04 GMT -5
They do that in places in India all the time, sans the coyotes.
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Post by Doug on Nov 7, 2017 14:22:05 GMT -5
The more we talk about it the more I'm liking the coyote & buzzard idea. I think that is the most environmentally friendly approach. It may not seem respectful but it's clean. I wonder if it's legal.
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Post by Hobson on Nov 7, 2017 14:23:27 GMT -5
People do need closure, so I would never say don't do any kind of memorial when I'm gone. My mother did that and a few friends and family had a really rough time with it. My approach was to write a long obit, which at least satisfied some of them. She had chosen to be cremated and months later the ashes were placed in the plot next to my stepfather.
My father died in 1978 and I have not seen his grave since the funeral. Just never felt the need.
Not to offend anyone, but the most unsatisfying services I have been to were in Catholic churches, where it's a funeral mass and little or nothing is said about the deceased's life or family. Some are even a combined mass for all of those who have died since the last one. I think that, unless I have to be there, I won't attend those in the future.
I attended a service for a friend not long ago where the minister walked around and talked to people before the service. He asked how we knew the deceased and whether we had anything that we would like him to talk about. He had previously spent a fair amount of time with the widow, so was already prepared. Of course, the guy was a regular church goer, so that helped.
Maybe boomers getting away from the involved services and burials is part of the general getting away from organized religion.
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Post by Marshall on Nov 7, 2017 15:40:27 GMT -5
Or this, either way what you are buried in returns to the earth shortly after you do. Yes. But not to get particular. Your remains have a lot of nutrients that can do some good in the soil and in nature. When you immolate yourself, those nutrients are burned up. You get CO2 and crap in the air and just dirty ash on the ground/water. You're doing more harm than good. One of my first jobs out of college I worked with an old draftsman from Argentina. In a previous life he had been a gaucho. When he moved into a suburban community here, there was an apple tree in his backyard that was not very healthy. His solution was to dig a shallow trench around the base of the tree and bury some dead fish. He said the tree came back to life and produced an abundance of fruit.
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Post by Doug on Nov 7, 2017 15:47:03 GMT -5
Or this, either way what you are buried in returns to the earth shortly after you do. Yes. But not to get particular. Your remains have a lot of nutrients that can do some good in the soil and in nature. When you immolate yourself, those nutrients are burned up. You get CO2 and crap in the air and just dirty ash on the ground/water. You're doing more harm than good. One of my first jobs out of college I worked with an old draftsman from Argentina. In a previous life he had been a gaucho. When he moved into a suburban community here, there was an apple tree in his backyard that was not very healthy. His solution was to dig a shallow trench around the base of the tree and bury some dead fish. He said the tree came back to life and produced an abundance of fruit. Good argument for the coyote & buzzard route.
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Post by TKennedy on Nov 7, 2017 15:48:52 GMT -5
I would miss the jello and potato salad in the church basement. Every small town has a small group that go to every funeral just for the food.
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Post by dradtke on Nov 7, 2017 16:08:46 GMT -5
I would miss the jello and potato salad in the church basement. Every small town has a small group that go to every funeral just for the food. Well, yeah, it's not really a funeral without red jello. My father died a month before I was born. I went to an aunt's funeral when I was 50, and some of the church basement ladies sat and talked with me about my father's funeral. Some of those church basement ladies last a long time.
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Post by Chesapeake on Nov 7, 2017 16:33:21 GMT -5
Archaeology shows that one of the distinguishing characteristics of our species is we treat our dead with love and respect. It seems it's in our DNA. But that leaves a lot of latitude. When I'm gone, I want to be really gone - not hanging around to provide any last memories that might not be as flattering as I had wished. Which rules out an open casket. I've even thought of burial at sea. But I've recently been warming to the idea of cremation.
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Post by TKennedy on Nov 7, 2017 16:54:57 GMT -5
I would miss the jello and potato salad in the church basement. Every small town has a small group that go to every funeral just for the food. Well, yeah, it's not really a funeral without red jello. My father died a month before I was born. I went to an aunt's funeral when I was 50, and some of the church basement ladies sat and talked with me about my father's funeral. Some of those church basement ladies last a long time. My secretary’s mom died recently and the service was in this very small Lutheran church in the country on a gravel road. It was a sunny beautiful day. Their farm wasn’t far away. There was a casket, the whole congregation knew her as she was the organist for many years. They sang with gusto, you could feel the love in the room as she was a cool lady. They carried her out the front door 100 feet to her grave by her husband under a Maple tree in the church cemetery. The whole thing was a pretty profound spiritual experience. I drove home thinking wow,
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Post by brucemacneill on Nov 7, 2017 17:39:21 GMT -5
Being an improbabe but apparently possible electro-chemical reaction and not a religious one at that, I don't expect much from death. I assume it's a lot like anesthesia the lights go out, time passes unnoticed except that the nurse doesn't wake you up later. If there is a heaven or hell it's probably how you react to your last thoughts. So, in my theory, and I could be wrong, when I die it's not my problem. My family has a plot in Middleboro Massachusetts with room for me if I can get there. Mary wants to be cremated and has a few places she would like her ashes spread. In each case, if someone has a party that would be nice but with few family members around it won't really matter.
Somewhat sadly, when I was talking with my son about their decision to become foster parents he said "Frankly, we were talking and realized that assuming we outlive you, which is the plan, when we die there isn't anyone to give a shit because we don't have kids so maybe if we can make a positive impact on someone's life they'll at least remember us for a while". With the dissolution of the close knit family and the last couple of generations not having kids as much as the older generations did, I think that may be a revelation coming to a lot of middle-aged kids.
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Post by Marshall on Nov 7, 2017 17:40:45 GMT -5
. . . , Well, yeah, it's not really a funeral without red jello. . . . , Ooooh ! Jell-o salad with chopped lettuce and baby grapefruits and maraschino cherries embedded therein.
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