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Post by millring on Apr 16, 2019 9:40:05 GMT -5
This should put the pope in a very awkward position.
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Post by Marshall on Apr 16, 2019 9:54:54 GMT -5
Various day after pics seem to be showing a far better than expected outcome, such as it is. Yes. Stone is fireproof. It doesn't burn. And it doesn't weaken under extreme temperature like steel does. (Ask John about his kiln). But I'm sure what's still up there of the stone arch ceiling is compromised in many places. It's going to be a massive decade or longer project to bring it back. But, I'd be hopeful it could. First thing is they're going to have to build an exterior scaffold over the thing to provide a temporary shelter to keep the elements off the structure that is there. Then they'll have to build an interior scaffold from the floor up to the ceiling so they can support the ceiling and go about the task of re-laying the arches that are damaged. This is medieval technology. There aren't any of those masons still around. It will be quite an exciting project. PS - And you can ask John what the heck he means about the pope.
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Post by millring on Apr 16, 2019 10:01:58 GMT -5
I heard some commentary this morning that at least some of the renovation that's been going on has been to try to correct the fact that large areas of stone are spalling due to a previous renovation that used mortar that didn't match well with the stone.
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Post by RickW on Apr 16, 2019 10:07:39 GMT -5
Also heard that much of the artwork and artifacts had already been removed because of the renos.
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Post by millring on Apr 16, 2019 10:16:51 GMT -5
PS - And you can ask John what the heck he means about the pope. The social-justice-warrior-pope will suddenly have to answer for spending billions on a cathedral instead of feeding the poor or defeating Republicans?
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Post by fauxmaha on Apr 16, 2019 10:23:12 GMT -5
They'll fund the reconstruction by packaging shards of burnt roof trusses into wall mountable, Lucite encased display boxes.
This thing may end up being a money maker before its all said and done.
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Dub
Administrator
I'm gettin' so the past is the only thing I can remember.
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Post by Dub on Apr 16, 2019 11:39:42 GMT -5
They'll fund the reconstruction by packaging shards of burnt roof trusses into wall mountable, Lucite encased display boxes. This thing may end up being a money maker before its all said and done. Rick is LOLing but I’m sure Jeff is correct. Something like that will definitely happen. Eventually the combined weight of such artifacts will exceed the weight of the entire cathedral.
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Dub
Administrator
I'm gettin' so the past is the only thing I can remember.
Posts: 19,910
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Post by Dub on Apr 16, 2019 11:58:16 GMT -5
Various day after pics seem to be showing a far better than expected outcome, such as it is. Yes. Stone is fireproof. It doesn't burn. And it doesn't weaken under extreme temperature like steel does. Are you certain of this? Lime for mortar was traditionally made by burning lime and marble in huge in-ground furnaces called lime kilns. The stone was reduced by heat to leave its component lime. I think much of the cathedral is limestone.
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Post by epaul on Apr 16, 2019 12:58:22 GMT -5
The money solution would be to sell advertising space in the corner panes of the new stained glass windows: "This window brought to you by Exxon, the Energy of the Future", "Taste the Feeling! Coke!" and "The Trojan Man, Love's Protector".
And, being it's France and all, they could put a nice statue of the Michelin Man in one of corners dedicated to the lesser Saints. And they should certainly do a licensing deal with "LEGO" to have a Notre Dame Lego kit for the hawkers that surround the joint to sell.
This rebuild could be paid for in a year.
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Post by millring on Apr 16, 2019 13:01:39 GMT -5
They ought to rebuild the entire thing using modern materials and methods. Like the American Protestant Churches are doing:
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Post by coachdoc on Apr 16, 2019 13:35:55 GMT -5
They ought to rebuild the entire thing using modern materials and methods. Like the American Protestant Churches are doing: That is not inspirational.
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Post by billhammond on Apr 16, 2019 13:54:10 GMT -5
The money solution would be to put little advertising slogans in the corner panes of the new stained glass windows: "This window brought to you by Exxon, the Energy of the Future", "Taste the Feeling! Coke!" and "The Trojan Man, Love's Protector". And, being it's France and all, they could put a nice statue of the Michelin Man in one of corners dedicated to the lesser Saints. And they should certainly do a licensing deal with "LEGO" to have a Notre Dame Lego kit for the hawkers that surround the joint to sell. This rebuild could be paid for in a year. France's richest businessman, Bernard Arnault, and his luxury goods group LVMH pledged 200 million euros ($226 million) for the reconstruction. Billionaire Francois Pinault and his son, Francois-Henri Pinault, who is married to Salma Hayek, said they were giving 100 million euros from their company, Artemis, the holding company owning auction house Christie's and the main shareholder of luxury fashion houses including Gucci. French companies Total and L'Oreal each pledged 100 million euros.
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Post by majorminor on Apr 16, 2019 13:58:25 GMT -5
The Lord works in mysterious ways
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Post by dradtke on Apr 16, 2019 14:21:52 GMT -5
They ought to rebuild the entire thing using modern materials and methods. Like the American Protestant Churches are doing: That looks like a very large efficient dairy operation. They're milking something...
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Post by Marshall on Apr 16, 2019 14:22:27 GMT -5
A kiln is different than an open fire. A kiln traps the heat. That's it's purpose. In the well documented photos, the ND fire raged skyward. The stone arches were underneath. I'm sure they were damaged but they stand. They didn't see the heat they would have if the fire was underneath them. Stone does not contribute to combustion. It does not burn. In the US that's what we call fireproof. It doesn't contribute to combustion and doesn't significantly change properties like steel which turns into a wet noodle. Under intense heat (such as in a kiln) all materials will be affected. (Think of a pizza. . . . , ahhh how I like to think of pizza).
And concerning the Pope: it was the French President that said it would be rebuilt, not the Pope. I think the French people will pay for it (or a major portion) as a cultural icon/institution/tourist attraction.
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Post by Marshall on Apr 16, 2019 14:31:01 GMT -5
They'll fund the reconstruction by packaging shards of burnt roof trusses into wall mountable, Lucite encased display boxes. This thing may end up being a money maker before its all said and done. Absolutely. Real soon you're going to see a GoFundMe campaign, I'm sure.
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Post by Marshall on Apr 16, 2019 14:34:28 GMT -5
The Lord works in mysterious ways One never knows. This might spur a resurgence in Catholicism. Like a Phoenix from the ashes.
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Post by Marshall on Apr 16, 2019 14:38:53 GMT -5
They ought to rebuild the entire thing using modern materials and methods. Like the American Protestant Churches are doing: You don't want to sit in the choir loft.
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Post by Chesapeake on Apr 16, 2019 15:14:06 GMT -5
The money solution would be to put little advertising slogans in the corner panes of the new stained glass windows: "This window brought to you by Exxon, the Energy of the Future", "Taste the Feeling! Coke!" and "The Trojan Man, Love's Protector". And, being it's France and all, they could put a nice statue of the Michelin Man in one of corners dedicated to the lesser Saints. And they should certainly do a licensing deal with "LEGO" to have a Notre Dame Lego kit for the hawkers that surround the joint to sell. This rebuild could be paid for in a year. Well, if they're not afraid of being struck by bolts of lightning, why not? In the 1920s the French automaker Andre Citroën paid to light up the Eiffel Tower with 125,000 lightbulbs spelling out his name. www.messynessychic.com/2012/02/22/the-eiffel-tower-was-once-a-giant-advertising-billboard/
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Post by Chesapeake on Apr 16, 2019 15:27:32 GMT -5
What I'm waiting for, after the shock and grief play out, is the finger-pointing to start. I understand the difficulties of fighting a fire in such a massive, tall, and flammable structure, and in such a dense urban environment, but, sheesh. You'd think they'd have had a better plan to get more water on it faster, not to mention better prevention protocols, and better ways of detecting fire before it got out of control. I understand the first report of fire wasn't followed up on because a visual inspection turned up no smoke. The second one did, but that delay cost them a precious 15-20 minutes, which could have made all the difference.
I have a feeling somebody is going to be talking about dusting off the guillotine before this is over.
EDIT: This isn't meant to take anything away from the heroic actions of the French firefighters, without whom it surely would have been quantum leaps of worse. I'm talking about advance preparations for such an eventuality in terms of safe practices, fire detection, and other planning.
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