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Post by coachdoc on Sept 8, 2020 13:21:48 GMT -5
But some things just shouldn't be allowed to slide:
Naturally, Trump and his defenders are denying that he said these things, that Goldberg’s unnamed sources either don’t exist or are lying. And they’re doing so with a vehemence they usually reserve for stories they see as particularly damaging — that is, true. But other reporters have backed up and added to key elements of the Atlantic story, including at Fox News (Trump called for the Fox reporter’s firing).
From the ever fair Boston globe: And the story rings true because this sounds exactly like the Trump we know. “He’s not a war hero,” Trump said of US Senator John McCain, who was tortured and held prisoner for over five years during the Vietnam War. “I like people who weren’t captured.” Trump attacked the Gold Star parents of Humayun Khan, killed in Iraq. He has publicly insulted generals and belittled their service. He has praised accused and convicted war criminals. Trump has failed to speak up for the troops he commands after intelligence reports that Russians paid bounties to those who would harm American fighters in Afghanistan.
Ignorance? Careless disregard for service? Treason?
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Post by Marshall on Sept 8, 2020 13:24:10 GMT -5
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Post by Marshall on Sept 8, 2020 13:34:07 GMT -5
As I said in the other thread, those that are promoting this story are hoping that some of Trump's core voters, who are more conservative and want a strong military, will vote against him for his disrespect of fallen soldiers.
Don't know if it will work, or backfire. Only time, and an election, will tell.
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Post by majorminor on Sept 8, 2020 13:53:56 GMT -5
You know it MIGHT change some minds if there hadn't already been 3 1/2 years of (mostly) histrionic horseshit flying by. It's getting hard to tell what's real and what's just part of the plan any more.
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Post by aquaduct on Sept 8, 2020 14:04:42 GMT -5
By the way, is Portland still burning?
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Post by fauxmaha on Sept 8, 2020 14:06:06 GMT -5
From the ever fair Boston globe: And the story rings true because this sounds exactly like the Trump we know. Credulity is the new coin of the realm. |
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Post by epaul on Sept 8, 2020 14:06:29 GMT -5
The vast majority of Trump's core will not turn on him. But some will grow so disenchanted, disillusioned, disgusted and discouraged with what they finally come to believe he really is they will just will not vote. Period. They just won't be able to summon the desire, the energy, to do so. They won't become Biden supporters, they will just feel so sick about the kind of man Trump is they won't be able to swallow enough, ignore enough, to vote for him.
And, if so, it won't take that many, only a very few, to swing the swing the swing states.
The Trump non-voter. Disenchanted, Disillusioned, Discouraged, and Disgusted. Deflated, Depressed, and Departed.
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Post by aquaduct on Sept 8, 2020 14:10:10 GMT -5
The vast majority of Trump's core will not turn on him. But some will grow so disenchanted, disillusioned, disgusted and discouraged with what they finally come to believe he really is they will just will not vote. Period. They just won't be able to summon the desire, the energy, to do so. They won't become Biden supporters, they will just feel so sick about the kind of man Trump is they won't be able to swallow enough, ignore enough, to vote for him. And, if so, it won't take that many, only a very few, to swing the swing the swing states. The Trump non-voter. Disenchanted, Disillusioned, Discouraged, and Disgusted. Deflated and Departed. You underestimate the power of the alternative. By the way, is Portland still burning? |
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Post by millring on Sept 8, 2020 14:11:07 GMT -5
this sounds exactly like the Trump we know. There's your problem, right there. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2020 15:18:05 GMT -5
Acknowledging that I still work for the Empire, and am beholden to the Hatch Act and other guidance, I will say that I REALLY don't like the old "anonymous source."
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Post by t-bob on Sept 8, 2020 15:32:39 GMT -5
The next threads are going to be so much better & interesting after the election & inauguration.
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Post by robjh22 on Sept 8, 2020 15:41:49 GMT -5
I don't know what he said or didn't say. I wasn't there. Neither was the Atlantic reporter.
But stating something like this to a reporter, "off the record," refusing to be identified and be thereby subjected to scrutiny and cross examination is chicken shit of the highest order. I can see an anonyous person -- maybe -- saying that there is some ongoing illegality and that there is some way to prove it. But this? Chickenshit. Anybody can say anything to a reporter. No one can prove a negative.
It is odd at best that John Bolton, no Trump ally he, denies it. He doesn't just say "I didn't hear it," he says it did not happen.
"Ignorance? Careless disregard for service? Treason?"
How about we first establish definitively that he said what the Atlantic claims?
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Post by millring on Sept 8, 2020 15:45:03 GMT -5
...and the Atlantic? Maybe we ought to cross-reference sources and fact check it with VOX and Mother Jones?
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Post by robjh22 on Sept 8, 2020 15:46:30 GMT -5
...and the Atlantic? Maybe we ought to cross-reference sources and fact check it with VOX and Mother Jones? LOL. I thought about that. But I have actually seen some reasonable articles published in the Atlantic, though I don't remember when. |
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Post by aquaduct on Sept 8, 2020 15:48:09 GMT -5
...and the Atlantic? Maybe we ought to cross-reference sources and fact check it with VOX and Mother Jones? Isn't that an oxymoron? |
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Post by Russell Letson on Sept 8, 2020 16:11:55 GMT -5
I'd point out that there's a difference between an anonymous source and an unnamed source.
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Post by millring on Sept 8, 2020 16:20:24 GMT -5
:: nods ::
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Post by fauxmaha on Sept 8, 2020 16:24:32 GMT -5
The vast majority of Trump's core will not turn on him. But some will grow so disenchanted, disillusioned, disgusted and discouraged with what they finally come to believe he really is they will just will not vote. That's one way of looking at it. And certainly that's how the editors of The Atlantic (along with the hoard of Democratic pols who jumped at this latest story like a hound dog going after a greasy skillet) hope it goes down. And no doubt that formulation describes some 2016 Trump voters exactly. But like all streets, this one runs both ways, and if 2016 tells us anything, it's that it might be worth paying attention to what's happening on the other side. I'd wager (quite safely, because there is no way to measure this, and therefore no way to prove me wrong) that for every "disenchanted, disillusioned, disgusted and discouraged" 2016 Trump voter, there are at least two "reluctant but what the hell" 2016 Trump voters who see all this and find whatever disgust they are supposed to feel toward Trump being felt five-fold toward the anti-Trump-Democrat-Media-Alliance. And I'll further wager that for every such Trump voter, there are 1.827 Hillary voters who feel that same disgust and have decided to vote Trump this time around. I expect that the precision in that number will persuade you that a lot of detailed computations have gone into this analysis. |
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Post by millring on Sept 8, 2020 16:31:23 GMT -5
For what it's worth, I personally know more people who will be voting for Trump this time who couldn't fathom the notion (in fact, argued vehemently against it) in 2016
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Post by millring on Sept 8, 2020 16:32:22 GMT -5
I wish I had put decimal points in my comment too. I now see how persuasive they are.
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