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Post by amanajoe on Sept 6, 2021 6:24:40 GMT -5
Jacques was such a Prevert.
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Post by Marshall on Sept 6, 2021 7:36:15 GMT -5
Gene, your services for this group are truly appreciated. Your recordings bring back the sweetest of memories. Thank you for your kind words, but I have to admit, Im selfish. I want to keep time around for a while. One thing I was lucky enough to realize very early, on is that, the moment you always wait for, to come, is gone before you realize that it arrived. My entire life is things that I have memories of and stories to match. I do not remember all the details, but enough to bring that feeling back for a brief moment. I am a collector of time. It is the most precious of all things and a terrible thing to waste. A line from Harry Chapin I have alway liked, that kinda describes how I feel... So it is me, that thanks all of you, for allowing me to add to my collection... That is sweetly told, Gene.
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Post by gbacklin on Sept 6, 2021 12:12:05 GMT -5
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Post by coachdoc on Sept 6, 2021 13:18:30 GMT -5
Pretty. But, once again who is that? Thanks
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Post by gbacklin on Sept 6, 2021 13:21:17 GMT -5
Pretty. But, once again who is that? Thanks Our own Mr Hammond, From the same evening as Autumn Leaves in 2004 at the Coffee Grounds.
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Post by billhammond on Sept 6, 2021 14:14:00 GMT -5
Pretty. But, once again who is that? Thanks Our own Mr Hammond, From the same evening as Autumn Leaves in 2004 at the Coffee Grounds. Lots of nervousness in that vocal but at least I'm on pitch and didn't mess up the words. There's a verse I leave out that has to do with the Green Hornet, just struck me as a bit arcane for general consumption.
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Dub
Administrator
I'm gettin' so the past is the only thing I can remember.
Posts: 19,910
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Post by Dub on Sept 6, 2021 18:22:02 GMT -5
LJ's chart reminded me that I first encountered the tune (via sheet music I still have somewhere, 50 years later) in G, which is the key my jazz pals call it in. But the C version is easier for non-jazzers (aside from that pesky m7-flat-5). So I Googled and found this interesting post about the influence of Real Book on setting standard keys: keyboardimprov.com/why-is-autumn-leaves-played-in-the-key-of-e-minor/I recall that the old, illegal Real Book was full of errors and oddities that later, legal editions fixed. When I take on a tune that I'm not learning for the jazz group (all users of marked-up Real Books), the first place I check is the Frank Mantooth collections, whose renderings are quite accurate (and which I always simplify). Based on the earliest recorded versions by Yves Montand, it seems the original key is Gm (two flats). Not sure what you mean by "the C version." Do you mean Am (no sharps or flats) like LJ's arrangement? Or do you mean any arrangement for "C" instruments? I haven't checked my Real Books yet but all the chord charts in my iReal Pro app seem to have it in Gm.
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Post by TKennedy on Sept 6, 2021 18:47:54 GMT -5
Almost every chart I have seen starts with Am7 D7 Gmaj7 CMaj7 f#m7b5 B7 Em Isn't that concert pitch Em? That's the way we play it. Interestingly the iRealPro app has basically those changes but says it's Gm. I'm confused. I wonder if that is a horn key. It would be three half steps up which would work for a sax if the guitar is in Em I think. www.apassion4jazz.net/transposition.htmlI have never figured out that whole key signature thing with wind instruments vs. stringed. Probably has a lot to do with why you never seem to see jazz/show/big band tune in certain keys.
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Post by Russell Letson on Sept 6, 2021 19:27:41 GMT -5
I have misused the standard harmony terminology. The tune begins with a ii-V-I move that goes to a GMa7 before going on to C in bar 4, so for some reason I've always mentally labelled it as "in" C, though I should know better. It's in Em, which is the relative minor of G, where that first ii-V-I move lands. And that's distinct from the version that starts Cm-F7-BMa7. That one's not in C, either, but in Gm--the relative minor of Bb.
This is why I tend to learn a tune as a series of grips and moves and to just look at the last bar when asked what key it's in.
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Post by Russell Letson on Sept 6, 2021 19:44:48 GMT -5
Terry--the B-flat "horn" editions I see are just transposed a full step lower than the "C instruments" books. When I don't have a chart and need to figure out what key a tune is in, if I'm next to the sax player, I peek at his chart and knock everything down a step. But since I got the iGigbook app, its transposing-chart "book" solves most of my problems with non-canonical keys. (A very good new singer started sitting in recently, and many of her arrangements are in her vocal keys, so there has been much transposing going on. Good practice for me.)
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Post by TKennedy on Sept 6, 2021 19:50:05 GMT -5
I know when we are in C our trumpet player is in Bb I think and when a sax player is with us they are in Eb.
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Dub
Administrator
I'm gettin' so the past is the only thing I can remember.
Posts: 19,910
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Post by Dub on Sept 6, 2021 20:04:50 GMT -5
I found this at www.christmasmusicsongs.com/transposition-explanation.htmlI still don't understand why this is true. A Bb instrument is still able to play a concert C note. Why can't they just tell the players that the fingering which produces a concert C note is how you play a C. Problem solved (at least in my inadequate brain.)
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Post by Cornflake on Sept 6, 2021 20:29:19 GMT -5
"Lots of nervousness in that vocal but at least I'm on pitch and didn't mess up the words."
I keep waiting for a recording where I was on pitch.
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Post by TKennedy on Sept 6, 2021 20:58:24 GMT -5
I still don't understand why this is true. A Bb instrument is still able to play a concert C note. Why can't they just tell the players that the fingering which produces a concert C note is how you play a C. Problem solved (at least in my inadequate brain.) [/quote] Me too!! Let’s start a movement. When we are playing in C and the sax player takes a solo we will scream “you are in fookin C not Eb!!”
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Post by gbacklin on Sept 6, 2021 21:50:12 GMT -5
"Lots of nervousness in that vocal but at least I'm on pitch and didn't mess up the words." I keep waiting for a recording where I was on pitch. I beg to differ, sir... End of the West
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Post by TKennedy on Sept 6, 2021 22:03:29 GMT -5
Wow!
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Post by gbacklin on Sept 6, 2021 22:26:35 GMT -5
Our own Mr Hammond, From the same evening as Autumn Leaves in 2004 at the Coffee Grounds. Lots of nervousness in that vocal but at least I'm on pitch and didn't mess up the words. There's a verse I leave out that has to do with the Green Hornet, just struck me as a bit arcane for general consumption. For those who would like to enjoy the entire evening of music, I have added the audio to my Idiot Jam podcast. here
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Dub
Administrator
I'm gettin' so the past is the only thing I can remember.
Posts: 19,910
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Post by Dub on Sept 6, 2021 23:52:02 GMT -5
Looking at chord sheets for Les Feuilles Mortes/Autumn Leaves from the iReal Pro playlists. The playlists I have installed are: There's a medium-swing chart in Gm — Cm7|F7|BbMaj7|EbMaj7|ADim7|D7(b13)|Gm6|Gm6:| An odd Gypsy Jazz ballad in 6/8 time that says its in Gm but seems to be in D — Gm|Gm Cm|D7 |D7 Gm|G7|G7 Cm|Adim7|Adim7 D7:| The Django Fakkebook 2008 has two versions, one in Gm similar to the one at the top and an odd one in ¾ time, 90 bpm that seems to be in D. The last one is in Gm and is also much like the first one above. None in iReal Pro seem to be in Em. In iGigBook, The Django Fake Book has Les Feuilles Mortes in 6/8 time in the key of two flats (Gm) but it always seems to resolve to a D7 (the 5 chord). Autumn Leaves is in The Colorado Cookbook in Fm (four flats). It's in the Classic Real Book, The Real Book of Blues, Jazz Fakebook (Ultimate), Real Jazz Standards Fake Book, and Real Book 6th Edition all in Em (one sharp). It's in 557 Jazz Standards and Jazz Chord Charts - Transpose in Gm (two flats) Here is an analysis of the changes from the site Learn Jazz Standards. I realize everyone following this stuff already understands all this but I figured it might be informative for some.
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Post by drlj on Sept 7, 2021 7:38:30 GMT -5
It’s interesting to me how the chords vary from arrangement to arrangement but it still sounds like Autumn Leaves.
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Post by RickW on Sept 7, 2021 8:43:30 GMT -5
It’s interesting to me how the chords vary from arrangement to arrangement but it still sounds like Autumn Leaves. I have two very different versions of Summertime. One very jazzy, with some m7b5 chords. One just a straight minor blues, with some dominant 7th chords. Both sound great, just give a very different feel.
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