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Post by billhammond on Jul 15, 2023 18:19:19 GMT -5
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Post by Village Idiot on Jul 15, 2023 19:03:42 GMT -5
I can read it, so I did. There's a big mess going on all around us.
Like anyone else, some things leave me just shaking my head. Like when people raise their hands after a mass shooting and say there isn't anything effective we can do.
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Post by Marshall on Jul 15, 2023 19:35:41 GMT -5
Very sad and very telling. The 2nd Amendment has been subverted. And TX and other states are producing thousands of fire arms that get resold illegally and end up on the streets in northern states.
It’s criminal.
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Post by jdd2 on Jul 15, 2023 21:24:19 GMT -5
Mexican cartels get their guns from the US, too.
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Post by epaul on Jul 15, 2023 22:21:06 GMT -5
Well, that's one industry that hasn't been taken over by the Chinese. Yet.
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Post by aquaduct on Jul 16, 2023 10:52:52 GMT -5
Nope. Can't read it. But that's okay. I'm sure it's the same tired gun control nonsense amped up with gruesome pictures.
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Post by amanajoe on Jul 16, 2023 11:23:26 GMT -5
Having friends that are police in major US cities, and also those in the gun industry, this is another example of policy failure and evil only needing good people to do nothing.
Police aren't even attempting to arrest felons with weapons on them, they know that nothing will be done to them in the justice system. They just take the weapons away from them and that's that.
The article states that people selling the weapons suspected or outright knew that the person involved was a straw purchaser and at any point could've refused to sell to him or contacted authorities about him, but didn't. Good people doing nothing.
When I was young the streets were filled with knives but rarely anything more than the 22 revolvers "Mr Saturday night special" or zip guns. Why? The old saying then was do a crime with a gun in your hand, spend 5 to 10 in the fed can. While the laws haven't changed, the application of them has.
I'll probably rethink this whole post and delete it, but it is here for the moment.
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Post by james on Jul 16, 2023 13:32:07 GMT -5
No problem reading the article here. I'd be interested to see how AG Ellison's lawsuit against Fleet Farm goes.
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Post by millring on Jul 16, 2023 13:38:43 GMT -5
Why, more than any time in our history, do we have so more human beings who want to kill multiple people? Even people they don't know?
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Post by John B on Jul 16, 2023 14:25:59 GMT -5
Why, more than any time in our history, do we have so more human beings who want to kill multiple people? Even people they don't know? Aside from more people (which would account for the sheer number), I suspect we just have more access to more effective weapons. |
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Dub
Administrator
I'm gettin' so the past is the only thing I can remember.
Posts: 20,473 
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Post by Dub on Jul 16, 2023 15:03:24 GMT -5
Having friends that are police in major US cities, and also those in the gun industry, this is another example of policy failure and evil only needing good people to do nothing. Police aren't even attempting to arrest felons with weapons on them, they know that nothing will be done to them in the justice system. They just take the weapons away from them and that's that. The article states that people selling the weapons suspected or outright knew that the person involved was a straw purchaser and at any point could've refused to sell to him or contacted authorities about him, but didn't. Good people doing nothing. When I was young the streets were filled with knives but rarely anything more than the 22 revolvers "Mr Saturday night special" or zip guns. Why? The old saying then was do a crime with a gun in your hand, spend 5 to 10 in the fed can. While the laws haven't changed, the application of them has. I'll probably rethink this whole post and delete it, but it is here for the moment. I’m quoting it. Hope you don’t mind. |
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Post by billhammond on Jul 16, 2023 16:09:57 GMT -5
No problem reading the article here. I'd be interested to see how AG Ellison's lawsuit against Fleet Farm goes. I will keep you apprised of any developments. |
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Post by t-bob on Jul 16, 2023 16:14:43 GMT -5
Dub "Hope you don’t mind.".
The book should be on an outhouse. We are obviously know there's a lot of violence but the book is a waste - toilet paper
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Post by Village Idiot on Jul 16, 2023 17:09:43 GMT -5
Having friends that are police in major US cities, and also those in the gun industry, this is another example of policy failure and evil only needing good people to do nothing. Police aren't even attempting to arrest felons with weapons on them, they know that nothing will be done to them in the justice system. They just take the weapons away from them and that's that. The article states that people selling the weapons suspected or outright knew that the person involved was a straw purchaser and at any point could've refused to sell to him or contacted authorities about him, but didn't. Good people doing nothing. When I was young the streets were filled with knives but rarely anything more than the 22 revolvers "Mr Saturday night special" or zip guns. Why? The old saying then was do a crime with a gun in your hand, spend 5 to 10 in the fed can. While the laws haven't changed, the application of them has. I'll probably rethink this whole post and delete it, but it is here for the moment. Don't delete it. |
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Post by millring on Jul 16, 2023 17:13:08 GMT -5
Why, more than any time in our history, do we have so more human beings who want to kill multiple people? Even people they don't know? Aside from more people (which would account for the sheer number), I suspect we just have more access to more effective weapons. Really? You think there've always been people who dreamed of fame by killing a mass of people but they simply lacked the means? |
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Post by billhammond on Jul 16, 2023 18:46:30 GMT -5
Really? You think there've always been people who dreamed of fame by killing a mass of people but they simply lacked the means? JohnB said nothing of the sort. His point, as I read it, is that with it ever easier for people who should not have handguns to acquire and sell lots of them, bad guys are likelier to bring them into public play, for whatever perverse motivation. |
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Post by james on Jul 16, 2023 19:03:43 GMT -5
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Post by John B on Jul 16, 2023 19:08:47 GMT -5
Aside from more people (which would account for the sheer number), I suspect we just have more access to more effective weapons. Really? You think there've always been people who dreamed of fame by killing a mass of people but they simply lacked the means? The dream was not possible before the means to accomplish it existed. On edit: I think I misunderstood your original post when I first responded, but I think your response cleared it up for me. |
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Post by millring on Jul 16, 2023 19:44:32 GMT -5
Really? You think there've always been people who dreamed of fame by killing a mass of people but they simply lacked the means? The dream was not possible before the means to accomplish it existed. On edit: I think I misunderstood your original post when I first responded, but I think your response cleared it up for me. So you don't think mass killings/shootings represent a different motivation than before in history? |
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Post by david on Jul 16, 2023 20:01:26 GMT -5
I do not recollect when background checks began being required before the purchase of a gun - the 1990s? Anyway, you used to be able to buy a gun if you could prove you were over 18 years of age. No other questions asked. So I do not buy into the argument that access to guns is the root reason for f-ing nutsos killing multiple people now. On the flip side, the guns that you could buy off the shelf were likely not able to have a 30 round magazine.
But I think the increasing number of mass shootings is a change in values, personal responsibility, attitude, etc.
I do not think that there is a means for the government to re-establish these old values. And, it seems inappropriate for government to try to do so.
So, if we, as a society want to reduce mass shootings, we need to find a different way. I think it might be a bit of what Amanajoe recommended - enforce the law regarding the illegal use of guns. (I currently sued a guy in a civli matter, looked up his record and he has been arrested in three different counties for felon in possession of a firearm. I believe that he was convicted in two of the three counties. He was not in jail when I filed suit against him.
(Well, now that I think about it, enforcing laws for the illegal use of guns is the government trying to change values. This political stuff is not easy!).
In addition to enforcing the law, it seems to make sense to me to limit the magazine capacity of some of the most highly effective killing guns and require that guns be designed in a manner that does not allow them to be easily modified to provide more than a 5 or 10 round magazine.
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