How the #^@% Did Duane Allman Do It?

[howard lee]

I am going to a guitar party in two weeks, and have been working on getting two songs together for Tonguy (also going) and me to play together. So, the first tune is Badfinger's "No Matter What." Via text, we chatted, and he asked if I could do the solo with a slide instead of bare fingers, like the original. I said I'd bust out my old steel slide, slip it on my little finger, and see.

Holy cow! It sounds much better when I just slide my fingers over the strings. I can't for the life of me figure out how to hit single notes without other strings sounding off too, and trying to use a couple of other fingers to mute the overtones. Good golly. It sounds like homemade hell. How did Duane Allman play such clean solos with a bottleneck slide in standard tuning? Do I need a smaller glass slide instead of this steel tube? Do I need to find an old Coricidin bottle like Duane's? Who here plays slide (looking at you, PaulKay.)?

Any tips or suggestions (not obscene) would be most welcome.

Help me.

[drlj]

Allman wore his glass slide on his ring finger. He played in standard tuning but also favored E tuning.
Your 1st & 2nd fingers are behind the slide to mute strings and overtones.
Metal slides sound scratchy & harsh to me. Use glass or ceramic.
Dunlop & D’Addario sell recreations of Duane’s Coricidin bottle. It has to be smooth—no seam.
You can get actual wine bottle necks but the lip can screw you up.
Tons of how to videos on YouTube.

[billhammond]

Watch some Bonnie Raitt vids -- one of the cleanest slide players ever. YouTube has lots with closeups of her fingerings. So effortless, so melodically powerful. The power of restraint.

[aquaduct]

From what I've read (I've managed a poor representation of slide when Christal has forced me to) another key is to change your guitar set up. Higher action and heavier strings. Makes whatever guitar you do it to kind of a specialty thing.

That's why I've never seriously tried.

[Marty]

Any tips or suggestions (not obscene) would be most welcome.

You're no fun at all!

[John B]

I find a tight-fitting slide to be best for me. Like snug enough so my finger doesn't have to work at all to keep the slide on. It is snug.

I also slide with my pinky, I believe because that's what Ry Cooder and a few other "acoustic" sliders recommended. Bonnie Raitt slides with her middle finger, as does Jason Isbell.

I prefer a glass or ceramic slide, on acoustic and electric. Thicker walls are better. The Dunlop Mudslide 263 is a good fit for my pinky. When I have the option I prefer a shorter slide rather than a longer slide. If I can I like it so I can still bend the knuckle closest to my palm. Any modern remake of a Coricidin bottle is too thin and too large for me.

I believe Duane played sans picks; fingers that aren't actually picking strings should be muting the strings not actively being picked. Like LJ said, the left index and/or middle finger are used to mute as well so you don't get the "behind the slide" tones/overtones.

I suspect "No Matter What" is played in open A, rather than in standard. I have a hunch sliding in standard was not... standard at the time. But it's doable. I picked out the solo in E (before I re-listened to the recording) and it sat OK on the FB. Actually open E would work well, too, but then you're playing in A when tuned to E, and it becomes a little bit of a brain twister, so I wouldn't necessarily try it. It works OK on lap steel, but bottleneck is a little different. Regardless of the tuning, the only slide bit is the solo.

My favorite glass slide, a former bottleneck. I wish I could remember who made it so I could get another one.



My favorite domed glass slide, purchased at Mandolin Brothers in 2000.



My favorite brass slide, a Latch Lake Acousta Glide. It's tapered, with a heavier end. I think this is what Leo Kottke uses. I like it with the heavier end at the hand-end of the slide.

[millring]

I thought when you're under house arrest you wear those things on your ankle, not your wrist.

[John B]

Nah, after messing around in both open A and standard it very well may have been standard. On strings 2-3-4, centered around frets 5-6-7 for the A, then up to 7-7-9 for the Bm, then 7-7-7 (D) 9-9-9 (E) a couple of times and then 2-2-2, and a slide on the 3rd string from 2 to 14.

In open A it would be exactly the same only two frets lower, as the tuning relationship on strings 2-3-4 is the same in open A and in standard.

[drlj]

A is good for slide. EAEAC#E
I never felt comfortable tuning to E so I usually tune to D. DADF#AD
Or G. DGDGBD
I prefer D or G to A, but use what works.

I have wine bottle slides, glass slides, mudslides, and even a Bauman slide. It sounds good but it’s a little too big.
I tend to wear mine on the 3rd finger. I can’t quite control it on my pinky. My pinky is too dinky.

[howard lee]

My brain can't handle open tunings. Like calculus.

Thank you for all the tips.

[Dub]

I haven’t played slide in years but I still keep a Cabernet bottle neck in my guitar case. I’ve played both open tunings and “missionary.” I had a version of Sleepwalk worked up on my Tele that was very close to Santo & Johnny. I started with the slide on my pinky but eventually discovered that the ring finger is best, especially in standard tuning. This is because you often want to mix slide notes and fretted notes and you really want your pinky available for fretted notes.

I also have a mighty fine stoneware slide given to me by Millring.

[billhammond]

May 12, 2024 21:34:55 GMT -5 howard lee said:

My brain can't handle open tunings. Like calculus.

You play in Drop D, right? You realize that other tunings are only one or two more strings away from that and actually make things easier, not harder?

When I was an active solo gigger, I used six different tunings (as I did on "Speechless") and plotted out my set lists so I never had to retune more than two strings between tunes.

[Marty]

I haven't played slide in a long time because I haven't worked on a slide players guitar in a long time. One thing I found was a glass slide works much better on electric guitar, less noisy. I've also found that fitting an O ring into the top end of the slide to grab the tip of your finger gives you much better control.

On a slide setup the heavier the string the lower the action can be and the thicker the tone. But the action will still be slightly higher because you want it to be a little flatter. A 12" radius fingerboard with heavier strings would work better if it were a 16" radius at the bridge. Using the slide on your pinky or ring fingers allows you to fret notes behind the slide if the action is high enough, Ry Cooder does this so he can get a minor chord in a major tuning. 

[epaul]

I gently hold the slide between my thumb and first two fingers. It is important to keep this grip very loose and relaxed as for certain fast position changes there are times you need to play slide toss and catch between your thumb and fingers. In all instances, it is a relaxed wrist that controls the fine movements of the slide.

[billhammond]

Speaking of Duane Allman, this blast from the past popped up on my YouTube feed today. My toss-away hand movements were both to clear the chord soundings and to give my ailing, cramping hands some relief. Lonnie called them my "spit-valve moves." God, I miss that guy.

[howard lee]

May 12, 2024 22:14:29 GMT -5 billhammond said:

May 12, 2024 21:34:55 GMT -5 howard lee said:

My brain can't handle open tunings. Like calculus.

You play in Drop D, right? You realize that other tunings are only one or two more strings away from that and actually make things easier, not harder?

When I was an active solo gigger, I used six different tunings (as I did on "Speechless") and plotted out my set lists so I never had to retune more than two strings between tunes.

Umm... about once every five or seven years. Yeah.

This could be a lost cause for me.

[drlj]

May 12, 2024 21:34:55 GMT -5 howard lee said:

My brain can't handle open tunings. Like calculus.

Thank you for all the tips.

You are just tuned to a chord in open tuning
Try D tuning. Slide to 12th fret, 5th fret, 7th fret and you have the 1, 4, 5 chords. Just play around and find some simple melodies like Happy Birthday.
I think it took Duane more than a day to get it.

[RickW]

I use a ring slide. This is from a local guy, black mountain, who also makes the picks I use. I use standard tuning, and I can still form chords normally with it. It’s not easy, it takes a super light touch, and some muting, but I’ve had way more success with this than anything else I’ve tried.


reverb.com/ca/item/80782448-black-mountain-picks-slide-regular-ring?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=18085516991&utm_content=campaignid=18085516991_adgroupid=_productpartitionid==merchantid=136366040_productid=80782448_keyword=_device=m_adposition=_matchtype=_creative=&gad_source=1&gbraid=0AAAAADRxZYVyvr-jwiO8TEgkBbmMf5fYx&gclid=CjwKCAjw9IayBhBJEiwAVuc3fkcMCmomA9L9_inIdJSzxUzYoS_OhnHGwA1i-93UDsaDBu_EqGbwfRoCQH8QAvD_BwE

[drlj]

[howard lee]

This is very helpful, but hard for me to wrap my handicapped brain around it. Thanks for posting it, LJ.

(I met David Hamburger years ago when he lived here, and was performing in local bars.)