|
Post by Fingerplucked on Nov 25, 2014 17:31:43 GMT -5
I just googled "Ferguson outside agitators." The first page of the results were all from August with the exception of one blog from last week and one Guardian article from October.
Strange . . . .
|
|
|
Post by brucemacneill on Nov 25, 2014 18:19:44 GMT -5
FOX's reporter said 80% of those arrested were from Ferguson. I think I heard there were around 60 arrests. So, so far besides Sharpton and Jackson not being there, there isn't any "Outside agitator" news really. See what happens tonight. There's supposed to be 2000 National Guard troops around but they probably don't have any weapons. They'll just be guarding last night's remains probably. All they'd need is one National Guard member to fire a shot and it would be Detroit 1968.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2014 18:55:49 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by godotwaits on Nov 25, 2014 19:12:00 GMT -5
I dare say Martin Luther King rolled over in his grave a couple of times last night.
|
|
|
Post by godotwaits on Nov 25, 2014 19:17:23 GMT -5
I noticed this morning that my neighbor has righted his lawn furniture. He'll find out tonight that this is far from over. Sock it 'em!! Sock it to 'em!!! Keep us abreast of your adventures.
|
|
|
Post by Doug on Nov 25, 2014 19:45:13 GMT -5
FOX's reporter said 80% of those arrested were from Ferguson. I think I heard there were around 60 arrests. So, so far besides Sharpton and Jackson not being there, there isn't any "Outside agitator" news really. See what happens tonight. There's supposed to be 2000 National Guard troops around but they probably don't have any weapons. They'll just be guarding last night's remains probably. All they'd need is one National Guard member to fire a shot and it would be Detroit 1968.
|
|
|
Post by patrick on Nov 25, 2014 19:51:43 GMT -5
I noticed this morning that my neighbor has righted his lawn furniture. He'll find out tonight that this is far from over. NO JUSTICE, NO PEACE. NO PEACE, NO LAWN FURNITURE! Its catchy.
|
|
|
Post by epaul on Nov 25, 2014 20:14:12 GMT -5
If I had been there, I would have stood, then slowly, and respectfully, begun to clap.
|
|
|
Post by epaul on Nov 25, 2014 20:58:11 GMT -5
The prosecutor had three choices. He could have decided there wasn't enough evidence prosecute the case and dropped the matter; he could have decided there was enough evidence to justify a trial, and prosecuted the case, or he could have decided that matter would be best decided by convening a Grand Jury and put the decision of trial or no trial in their hands. He decided the best course in a case of this magnitude to convene a Grand Jury and put the decision in their hands, not his.
He chose the Grand Jury.
Once the Grand Jury was convened he had a new round of decisions. He could have sought a decision one way or the other,and as an advocate presented the selected evidence in a prejudicial manner. Or he could just present all the evidence there was and let the Grand Jury, in their own speed and fashion, carefully go over every last bit of it for as long as they felt they needed.
He chose to let the Grand Jury have access to everything there was, every last bit and piece of it, then he let the Grand Jury take all the time and ask all the questions they wanted. Which they did. For three months. Three months! People who have gone over the transcripts of the proceedings say it is clear, the Grand Jury worked their responsible tails off on this one.
The prosecutor had a final decision. He could have kept the Grand Jury's work and the evidence they had access to closed. Or he could make the proceedings open and transparent. He chose that latter. The Feds were kept in the immediate and complete loop and the entire body of evidence the Grand Jury considered has been made public. Legal observers concur that this may be one of the most open Grand Jury proceedings in our legal history.
This guy understood the import of this case and took every step to make the process fair, open, and just.
And he is being lambasted by characters who had their opinions on this case set in stone a day after it hit the news wires. I actually heard some srewball on CNN criticize him for presenting the Grand Jury with too much evidence. For some, there is no stone too small to throw.
|
|
|
Post by Chesapeake on Nov 25, 2014 22:02:50 GMT -5
Making available all the evidence and testimony was a good thing, though I still think a trial would have been the better way to go in terms of satisfying the American public that justice would have been served by an acquittal. However, some people (like Sunny Hoskins of CNN) will refuse to believe the shooting was legally justified that no matter what. In their case it's a matter of political convictions trumping the facts every time. You seem to be assuming that the same court that is trying this on the street and in the internet by ignoring all the evidence available to them right now would somehow be more satisfied by exactly the same evidence given to them after a trial? Why? What I don't understand is how anyone could argue that a trial would not have been preferable. From everything I've seen, I imagine a trial would have resulted in an acquittal. But I don't know that, and neither does anyone else. Who knows what might have developed during the course of a trial, where witnesses are questioned by lawyers on both sides, vigorously and in detail, as opposed to the amateur Q-and-A sessions that seem to have taken place behind closed doors here? And the physical evidence, which on its face seems so compelling in Wilson's favor, is weighed against conflicting accounts, possibly subjected to other theories of what happened? Why, if we are so certain of his innocence, are we so quick to approve an outcome that skips a trial? And, equally important in my mind, instead of a star-chamber proceeding, it would have all been done in the open. I'm sure there are those who will never believe, no matter what, that the shooting was justified. But at least no one would have any rational excuse to ignore a not-guilty verdict.
People are saying the system has worked, let's move on. I believe system in fact has failed, and we as a society are going to have to live with the fact that a substantial portion of our fellow citizens forevermore will believe that, once again, they have been pranked by a system that is stacked against them.
|
|
|
Post by millring on Nov 25, 2014 22:04:23 GMT -5
a substantial portion of our fellow citizens forevermore will believe that, once again, they have been pranked by a system that is stacked against them. ...and that JFK was shot from the grassy knoll, and the Elvis still lives, and Roswell hides aliens, and man has never been to the moon, and the twin towers were bombed by Bush, and Obama was born in Kenya. It's getting harder and harder to convince the public that turning on windshield wipers isn't the cause of rain.
|
|
|
Post by Doug on Nov 25, 2014 22:05:46 GMT -5
While setting up for this afternoons gig the TV was on in the bar (don't know which network) but the reporter guy was grilling the prosecutor with questions like, "why did you let a guilty murder go?" "why did you let a racist cop who shot an innocent man in the back go?"
Media wants a race war.
|
|
|
Post by Chesapeake on Nov 25, 2014 22:11:39 GMT -5
a substantial portion of our fellow citizens forevermore will believe that, once again, they have been pranked by a system that is stacked against them. ...and that JFK was shot from the grassy knoll, and the Elvis still lives, and Roswell hides aliens, and man has never been to the moon, and the twin towers were bombed by Bush, and Obama was born in Kenya. It's getting harder and harder to convince the public that turning on windshield wipers isn't the cause of rain. There are many African-Americans in this country tonight who are intelligent and responsible people, and some of them are friends of mine, who believe there should have been a trial. Again, I believe it would have been a slam-dunk for the defense. And if so, that would have been obvious to all concerned by the time the verdict had been reached.
|
|
|
Post by millring on Nov 25, 2014 22:16:01 GMT -5
There are many African-Americans in this country tonight who are intelligent and responsible people You'll get no argument from me on that.
|
|
|
Post by epaul on Nov 25, 2014 22:20:12 GMT -5
..................
(now I got to put it back)
You don't charge someone with murder just because an angry mob demands it.
|
|
|
Post by Chesapeake on Nov 25, 2014 22:20:14 GMT -5
John, you left out the last part of my sentence: intelligent and responsible African-Americans who believe there should have been a trial. Do you believe that?
|
|
|
Post by Chesapeake on Nov 25, 2014 22:22:17 GMT -5
You don't charge someone with murder just because an angry mob demands it. No argument from me there. It was more than an angry mob that wanted it, though. EDIT: In fact, I don't know of a single respectable civil-rights leader who has any actual credibility with the African-American community that didn't want a trial, and who thinks now that not having one was a good idea.
|
|
|
Post by millring on Nov 25, 2014 22:22:19 GMT -5
John, you left out the last part of my sentence: intelligent and responsible African-Americans who believe there should have been a trial. Do you believe that? Sure. And I'd bet there are also intelligent and responsible African-Americans who believe justice was served today. The wrong of assigning one way of thinking to an entire group of people goes both ways, you know?
|
|
|
Post by billhammond on Nov 25, 2014 22:24:49 GMT -5
While setting up for this afternoons gig the TV was on in the bar (don't know which network) but the reporter guy was grilling the prosecutor with questions like, "why did you let a guilty murder go?" "why did you let a racist cop who shot an innocent man in the back go?" Media wants a race war. OK, Doug, I am calling total bullshit on this post if you cannot provide at least one skinny link to anything approaching what you claim to have heard.
|
|
|
Post by Chesapeake on Nov 25, 2014 22:27:03 GMT -5
John - see my edit, above, re civil-rights leaders who have any credibility with the African-American community. (We cross-posted.)
See you tomorrow. Going to see if there's anything on TV tonight.
|
|