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Post by casualplayerpaul on Oct 18, 2017 7:47:13 GMT -5
You are easy to refute and have been refuted. Several pretty intelligent folks have answered your question about what makes us tick and why we believe what we believe. Every time one of these inane "Why are Trump supporters such morally bankrupt idiots?" questions comes up, I have to shake my head in disbelief. I wonder if the question comes from someone who's spent any time on this planet. Trump has a tense staff meeting over Afghanistan and suddenly he "knows more than the generals". Seriously? Haven't these folks had a real job with a real boss? Isn't that how staff meetings sometimes go? Trump says something in Puerto Rico about how few deaths there were relative to Katrina and suddenly he's Satan incarnate? Seriously? Anybody here remember Katrina? And the pounding Bush and his FEMA took? So Trump says something about how effective the response to recent hurricanes has been- probably mostly to boost responder's morale- and somehow me and others like me who get what he said are lambasted as Satan' spawn for committing the unforgivable sin of having another take that sees his point? And now you. What you've quoted here doesn't rise to the level of a lie unless you're just dead set on seeing that. So who cares? Certainly not me. I've played ball with the professional assholes in DC. You guy's are child's play in comparison. You want your self righteous anger, fine. Maybe you want to start doing something about it. Like winning elections. I get it, yep. The explanations are a bit post-modern for my taste, but we all get to construct our own realities, I don't have enough empathy for people who are still living out their anger towards the last President and lies aren't lies unless they meet a threshold. Meanwhile, this all began with four dead soldiers in Niger, virtually ignored by Trump for over two weeks . Just saying. Had Niger happened in Hillary's watch, many, many people would be screaming "Benghazi II!"
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Post by aquaduct on Oct 18, 2017 8:00:17 GMT -5
...I don't have enough empathy for people who are still living out their anger towards the last President... Don't worry, we don't need your empathy. Our guy won.
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Post by jdd2 on Oct 18, 2017 8:02:24 GMT -5
For me, the last straw was when Trump said “I think that I’m a better speechwriter than my speechwriters, I know more about policies on any particular issue than my policy directors. And I’ll tell you right now that I’m going to think I’m a better political director than my political director.” Those of course actually spoken by Obama, in case anyone missed the irony. BS.
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Post by coachdoc on Oct 18, 2017 8:06:26 GMT -5
I think there is a meta-game at play here... If you want to make sense of it, consider this photo: Ok, to be fair, I looked at this photo a second time. And I reached the same over-riding thought as I did the first time...she's kind of hot! These guys look like the majority of my NH neighbors. What's the problem?
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Post by aquaduct on Oct 18, 2017 8:22:26 GMT -5
Ok, to be fair, I looked at this photo a second time. And I reached the same over-riding thought as I did the first time...she's kind of hot! These guys look like the majority of my NH neighbors. What's the problem? You mean outside of the fact that their son is a deserter?
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Post by james on Oct 18, 2017 9:13:48 GMT -5
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Post by brucemacneill on Oct 18, 2017 9:16:31 GMT -5
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Post by casualplayerpaul on Oct 18, 2017 9:58:53 GMT -5
“He knew he was getting into” - The current president, finally getting around to “comfort” the families of the fallen soldiers in Niger.
Claims he has proof that he did not say that.
Which, of course, means he did say it.
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Post by Chesapeake on Oct 18, 2017 13:34:26 GMT -5
Just how bad do you have to think Hillary is to think that Trump is the lesser of two evils? And plenty of Trump supporters I hear see him as anything but that--they're fans. It's not how bad she was. It was the particular brand of how bad she was. It was the fact that the press's "October Surprise" backfired so badly because they failed to note that their bringing up Trump's sexual predatory nature only reminded most of American that Hillary was exactly the wrong alternative candidate. She could not have been the more exactly wrong candidate if the point was to, with a vote, make a public statement about sexual predators. She and the Democrats supported one throughout the '90s. ...and then we were reminded that, despite her and the Democrats having supported such predatory behavior throughout the '90s...she had the audacity to call us "A Basket of Deplorables". And of the few supporters of Trump that I know, nobody shrugs off every misstatement. I'm not sure it's especially fruitful to keep comparing Trump and Clinton through the lens of the 2016 election. At that time the binary choice was between the two of them. As of this moment the operative comparison is between Trump and Pence. If I were a true-blue conservative, I would be praying for impeachment or the 25th Amendment to kick in.
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Post by fauxmaha on Oct 18, 2017 13:59:10 GMT -5
The disappointing part is that the solution is built into the Constitution. As written, the Constitution never contemplated a Federal government with the scope that ours has acquired. The intent was that the Federal government do those (few) things that are inherently national in scope, and leave the rest to the states. For better or worse, we have been on a 100+ year march toward all rendering the states all but irrelevant, and concentrating all government function at the Federal level. And we wonder why the country is "divided"? Why wouldn't it be? Everything we do involves trying to come up with a single solution that satisfies both Texas and Massachusetts (to pick a couple of contrasting states). Why would Texas want to be ruled by Massachusetts? Why would Wisconsin want to be ruled by Louisiana? We can either re-discover the wisdom of the Federalist approach, or we can watch the country eventually spin apart. It will be truly interesting to see how this election plays out. There is no "winning" possible here. Whoever wins (presumably either Clinton or Trump) will face an enormous credibility problem. They are both profoundly flawed candidates. Either one will limp into office with a huge rain cloud hanging over their head.
One way or another, it is not going to be pretty. (It occurs to me that by now, we've all posted the same thought enough times that we can just go back and recycle the old ones. Which, if I recall, is also a thought that's already been discussed.)
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Post by Deleted on Oct 18, 2017 14:13:11 GMT -5
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Post by Chesapeake on Oct 18, 2017 15:28:30 GMT -5
The disappointing part is that the solution is built into the Constitution. As written, the Constitution never contemplated a Federal government with the scope that ours has acquired. The intent was that the Federal government do those (few) things that are inherently national in scope, and leave the rest to the states. For better or worse, we have been on a 100+ year march toward all rendering the states all but irrelevant, and concentrating all government function at the Federal level. And we wonder why the country is "divided"? Why wouldn't it be? Everything we do involves trying to come up with a single solution that satisfies both Texas and Massachusetts (to pick a couple of contrasting states). Why would Texas want to be ruled by Massachusetts? Why would Wisconsin want to be ruled by Louisiana? We can either re-discover the wisdom of the Federalist approach, or we can watch the country eventually spin apart. It will be truly interesting to see how this election plays out. There is no "winning" possible here. Whoever wins (presumably either Clinton or Trump) will face an enormous credibility problem. They are both profoundly flawed candidates. Either one will limp into office with a huge rain cloud hanging over their head.
One way or another, it is not going to be pretty. (It occurs to me that by now, we've all posted the same thought enough times that we can just go back and recycle the old ones. Which, if I recall, is also a thought that's already been discussed.) Now hold on a minute there, mister. If we couldn't repeat ourselves .... say, you trying to kill the forum?
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Post by Cosmic Wonder on Oct 18, 2017 15:40:33 GMT -5
"He knew what he was getting into."
I have no words.
Mike
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Post by casualplayerpaul on Oct 18, 2017 15:42:45 GMT -5
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Post by millring on Oct 18, 2017 15:45:35 GMT -5
"He knew what he was getting into."
You know, after a day of listening to the documentary on WW1, I gotta say that's almost the perfect comment. It's not the least bit comforting and I'm thinking that maybe it shouldn't be. Damn war.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 18, 2017 15:50:43 GMT -5
I know this is stupid of me, weighing in like this, but I want to address a small point among the myriad intellectual supernovas in this particular cognitive universe.
To wit: What happened in Niger was nothing at all like what happened in Benghazi. Not even close.
Now back to your positional gymnastics, kids.
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Post by casualplayerpaul on Oct 18, 2017 16:17:02 GMT -5
I know this is stupid of me, weighing in like this, but I want to address a small point among the myriad intellectual supernovas in this particular cognitive universe. To wit: What happened in Niger was nothing at all like what happened in Benghazi. Not even close. Now back to your positional gymnastics, kids. Of course it's not. But that doesn't mean that Trey Gowdy wouldn't be investigating it and that the right wingosphere would not be flipping out had Hillary Clinton been elected and had she spent the past two weeks attacking her own party and making up things about what previous Presidents have or have not done.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 18, 2017 16:23:39 GMT -5
I know this is stupid of me, weighing in like this, but I want to address a small point among the myriad intellectual supernovas in this particular cognitive universe. To wit: What happened in Niger was nothing at all like what happened in Benghazi. Not even close. Now back to your positional gymnastics, kids. Of course it's not. But that doesn't mean that Trey Gowdy wouldn't be investigating it and that the right wingosphere would not be flipping out had Hillary Clinton been elected and had she spent the past two weeks attacking her own party and making up things about what previous Presidents have or have not done. That gets to the other point I thought about making, which is most of us Vets and many of my coworkers still in uniform, are just dead bored by folks using us as rhetorical poker chips in Congress (EDIT:, in the White House,) and in the blogosphere. It would be nice if folks would just leave us out of it all. I'd hazard to say the number of folks who had any clue we even had a military presence in Niger prior to that ambush would approach a fraction of 1 percent. We're mostly cool with that, so it'd be nice if the rest could admit they don't really care about us, alive or dead, until there are points to score over our graves. It's frankly disheartening.
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Post by Chesapeake on Oct 18, 2017 16:46:49 GMT -5
The question of whether Trump said those words ("he knew what he was getting into"), or something similar, is still contested. Trump says he didn't. But if he did, I would think that would about tear it among his remaining supporters in the military. It's annoying enough to hear it from ordinary civilians. But (speaking as one proud vet here) to hear it from the commander-in-chief? What planet does he live on?
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Post by Marshall on Oct 18, 2017 17:03:46 GMT -5
The question of whether Trump said those words ("he knew what he was getting into"), or something similar, is still contested. Trump says he didn't. But if he did, I would think that would about tear it among his remaining supporters in the military. It's annoying enough to hear it from ordinary civilians. But (speaking as one proud vet here) to hear it from the commander-in-chief? What planet does he live on? I'm tired of this whole line of thinking. Maybe he said it. Maybe it is out of context. It's just not freaking news. Except he has gone as far as to accuse Obama of not treating the families of fallen servicemen with proper respect. So, that opens the door for this otherwise miniscule hearsay discussion. Just more of the daily bullshit. I'm so tired of this.
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