|
Post by majorminor on Jan 4, 2022 10:27:46 GMT -5
Holy crap - guess I'm out of touch. Seeing lots of 60K half ton and 80K 3/4 ton pickups at the local dealer. Add 10K for diesel.
I should find out soon whether my F150 Lightning reservation was early enough to make the first distribution this summer. If not and it's another year, and/or more likely the dealer decides to slap a big scarcity upcharge on if I do make the cut, I'm going to bail on the electric F150 and probably going to start looking for another vehicle. I'm only interested in the F150 Lightning if I can get the stripped down work truck at 40K minus 8K tax rebate.
After a flight cancellation in Alaska we had to borrow mom's 2019 Chevy Traverse and make an emergency run from Kenai to Anchorage. 3 hours through the ice and snow and winding mountain roads with aplomb in 4WD and I fit in it, was comfortable, made 34.6 MPG, lots of fold down seat cargo options. Low slung enough to shoot right under a moose. After seeing prices for new gas trucks I'm now thinking about something like this for running around and keeping my old shop trucks for real truck stuff.
|
|
|
Post by TKennedy on Jan 4, 2022 10:49:32 GMT -5
Around here it seems like everyone is driving around in relatively new monster pickups. I mean these fookers are huge.
I looked at prices for those beasts and almost had to sit down.
|
|
|
Post by Cornflake on Jan 4, 2022 11:03:49 GMT -5
Big pickups make sense where Steve is but not here. I have enough trouble parking my Jeep Grand Cherokee in Phoenix. When I go down the back roads, it'll get me anywhere I want to go.
|
|
|
Post by Cosmic Wonder on Jan 4, 2022 11:06:17 GMT -5
Trucks have been spendy for a while.
Mike
|
|
|
Post by howard lee on Jan 4, 2022 11:09:54 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by epaul on Jan 4, 2022 12:59:14 GMT -5
The Chevy Traverse is a great used car buy. There are a lot of lease returns available with 30, 40 thousand miles on them. The Traverse is a..., well, it's an ugly, under-appreciated model in a generally unpopular category. It's a large "tweener", a car-like SUV, SUV-like station wagon, an awkward category that the Subaru Outback pulls off with aplomb but Chevy kind of bungled... all of which means you can get a lot of car for the money, because once you get past the bloated whale-like appearance, it is a roomy, comfortable, reliable, versatile vehicle, a Suburban designed for the Suburbs.
|
|
|
Post by Russell Letson on Jan 4, 2022 13:08:13 GMT -5
There's been some kind of culture-war stuff going on with trucks for quite a while. In mall parking lots I see lots of very shiny-clean, tricked-out, jacked-up king-cab trucks, often driven by big, bearded guys in cammo/Oakleys. These are not to be confused with what I take to be working trucks--older, not so clean, with toolboxes or plows or tow-rigs.
It reminded me of a few years back, when the bearded/cammo/Oakley guys were driving really jacked-up four-wheelers with knobbly tires and light bars, covered with mud from off-roading. (Their younger, townie cousins drive noisy little Civics with low-profile tires and aftermarket spoilers.)
|
|
|
Post by majorminor on Jan 4, 2022 13:41:23 GMT -5
The Chevy Traverse is a great used car buy. There are a lot of lease returns available with 30, 40 thousand miles on them. The Traverse is a..., well, it's an ugly, under-appreciated model in a generally unpopular category. It's a large "tweener", a car-like SUV, SUV-like station wagon, an awkward category that the Subaru Outback pulls off with aplomb but Chevy kind of bungled... all of which means you can get a lot of car for the money, because once you get past the bloated whale-like appearance, it is a roomy, comfortable, reliable, versatile vehicle, a Suburban designed for the Suburbs. This is a pretty fair assessment. It is pretty much one of those boxy little blahmobiles that are so popular and ubiquitous these days. I guess I was struck by the fact that I actually fit in it OK which is the first time I actually got my 6-5" self down in to one of those "tweeners", rolled my shoulders and stretch my legs, and went "Huh. Not bad". And that winter drive between Kenai and Anchorage during winter storm conditions is no cakewalk and that car stuck to the road just fine. Regarding the MPG I reset the on board computer before leaving Kenai and watched MPG creep up steadily to top out and hover around 34 MPG on a 3 1/2 hour hiway trip running 50-60 mph due to winding winter roads. As I research the vehicle seems like the stated MPG specs say 25 MPH hiway. So either that's wrong or the on board PC on the one I drove was incorrect. It was the 35mpg, 4WD, and actually fitting in it that made me consider one. Here in Montana most driving and vehicle use lends itself to a truck. You usually aren't going far, may be hauling hay one direction or poop the other direction, and who wants to hit an elk in Prius? But then suddenly you want/need to drive to the next big town up the hiway and in Montana that usually means a 5-8 hour trip one way and 15mpg sucks. Montana sucks too.
|
|
|
Post by aquaduct on Jan 4, 2022 13:58:51 GMT -5
Holy crap - guess I'm out of touch. Seeing lots of 60K half ton and 80K 3/4 ton pickups at the local dealer. Add 10K for diesel. I should find out soon whether my F150 Lightning reservation was early enough to make the first distribution this summer. If not and it's another year, and/or more likely the dealer decides to slap a big scarcity upcharge on if I do make the cut, I'm going to bail on the electric F150 and probably going to start looking for another vehicle. I'm only interested in the F150 Lightning if I can get the stripped down work truck at 40K minus 8K tax rebate. After a flight cancellation in Alaska we had to borrow mom's 2019 Chevy Traverse and make an emergency run from Kenai to Anchorage. 3 hours through the ice and snow and winding mountain roads with aplomb in 4WD and I fit in it, was comfortable, made 34.6 MPG, lots of fold down seat cargo options. Low slung enough to shoot right under a moose. After seeing prices for new gas trucks I'm now thinking about something like this for running around and keeping my old shop trucks for real truck stuff. Yeah, another victim of the mass formation psychosis that got your flight cancelled. There's a pretty simple reason why it's happening and why it's going to continue to happen- Federal regulation based on the global cooling/global warming/climate change BS is forcing elimination of fossil fuels in light duty vehicles based on the flawed premise that CO 2 is a pollutant. If a vehicle is regulated based on grams of CO2 per mile (or its mathematical inverse miles per gallon) instead of work output (grams per brake horsepower hour) that ultimately leaves the vehicle increasingly useless for anything practical (carrying more than a child and a baloney sandwich for instance). This has always been the market trend since the advent of CAFE regulations in about 1975 but was magnified in 2009 when the Supreme Court ruled that CO 2 could be considered a pollutant under the Clean Air Act (conveniently without legislative amendment to the CAA) and the Obama Administration implemented the idea full force. What was a 27.5 mpg standard for cars and light trucks became an effectively 36 mpg standard as the last thing Obama did as he turned over the White House to Trump who promptly cancelled that regulation (mostly because Obama's team had been extraordinarily sloppy in execution) and replaced it in 2018 with a more palatable 30 mpg standard. Biden just last week bumped the whole thing up to 40 mpg in 2026 on the way to ultimately 1/infinity (the math wizards here can tell you what that works out to). Meanwhile, trucks and other heavier classes of vehicles designed inherently to accomplish work rather than mileage have bumfuzzled the regulatory state because CO 2 and H 2O are the inevitable consequences of doing work. Simple high school chemistry. Burning a gallon of gasoline yields 19.6 pounds of CO 2. Burning a gallon of diesel fuel yields 22.3 pounds of CO 2. And those are the fossil fuels that produce the most energy per unit of any fuel that flows (which is of course why we don't use coal in cars). Electricity does not produce energy, it is the energy that is produced. Therefore it must be at a loss comparatively. The numbers I've seen from people who've done the calculations say as little as 5% of the energy that went in to making it. Whatever you've been lead to believe about climate change can't undo the basic physical facts. CO 2 production is necessary for life. The better the life, the more it's needed. Period. So now that I've obliterated the Proboard's misinformation police, back to the relation to your situation. In 2020 for the first time ever, trucks outsold cars in this country. It's going to get worse the more this bullshit is allowed to continue and trucks continue to be class 3 and above (trust me, the more they try to squeeze, the heavier duty they'll get). Biden may get (but I doubt it) a 30% share of electric vehicles in 2040, but only at the expense of shrinking the light duty segment by about 20 or 30%. And electric vehicles will continue to carry a 10-20% premium over comparable fossil fuels for the foreseeable future (no, there's no magic available no matter what the activists preach). Trucks will only continue to get more luxurious and expensive as people who want a trunk bigger than a sheaf of paper continue to be pushed out of smaller classes with less utility. After my Federal employment disaster and bankruptcy in 2010, we retooled our life in light of knowing what was coming down the road. Wife bought me a shiny new F150 4x4 Lariat built at the Dearborn Assembly plant (my hometown) with a God's honest 5.0 L Coyote (no turbo gimmicks to break) and a 36 gallon tank (a cruising range from here to Michigan to visit Mom and halfway back) in 2017 for our 30th anniversary. We then got her a new little Italian made Chrysler Jeep Renegade (loaded) in 2019 when it looked like she might have to commute (hasn't happened so far, but that only means there's 10,000 miles on the odometer). And both of those will be paid off this month. If I were you (for what it's worth), I'd dump the Lightning like it was hot and find a really nice gas powered little Ute like that Traverse. And hang on to that damned 6 cylinder F150 until it falls off the frame. It's only going to get worse with Joe and the progressives at the helm.
|
|
|
Post by aquaduct on Jan 4, 2022 14:04:21 GMT -5
Regarding the MPG I reset the on board computer before leaving Kenai and watched MPG creep up steadily to top out and hover around 34 MPG on a 3 1/2 hour hiway trip running 50-60 mph due to winding winter roads. As I research the vehicle seems like the stated MPG specs say 25 MPH hiway. So either that's wrong or the on board PC on the one I drove was incorrect. Published mpg figures are determined by a defined road cycle which probably won't come anywhere close to what you see driving it. If you got 34 mpg and that's a usual drive for you, that's what it is.
|
|
|
Post by Marshall on Jan 4, 2022 15:54:56 GMT -5
Saw some little bitty young woman trying to maneuver some big beast SUV into a parking space at the grocery store the other day. She see-sawed back and forth 3 or 4 times trying to fit the behemoth into a normal space. Held up traffic in the crowded parking lot for a couple minutes. Then out bounces this little thing in her yoga pants and hoody to tip-toe though the slush & scoot into the grocery store.
There's a time and a place for every size vehicle.
|
|
|
Post by aquaduct on Jan 4, 2022 16:08:49 GMT -5
Saw some little bitty young woman trying to maneuver some big beast SUV into a parking space at the grocery store the other day. She see-sawed back and forth 3 or 4 times trying to fit the behemoth into a normal space. Held up traffic in the crowded parking lot for a couple minutes. Then out bounces this little thing in her yoga pants and hoody to tip-toe though the slush & scoot into the grocery store. There's a time and a place for every size vehicle. Interestingly, little bitty young women have done a lot to drive the increasing popularity of trucks for at least the last 30 years. Turns out being able to see over surrounding traffic and be able to haul kids and a fair chunk of groceries and the like make trucks very attractive to women. So much so that Ford was actively marketing big trucks to women and doing a damn good job of it back in the 90's when I was there. Another reason for the move to increased luxury and creature comforts.
|
|
|
Post by majorminor on Jan 4, 2022 16:14:32 GMT -5
If I were you (for what it's worth), I'd dump the Lightning like it was hot and find a really nice gas powered little Ute like that Traverse. And hang on to that damned 6 cylinder F150 until it falls off the frame. Yeah. Kinda starting to think this way. If they offer me the Lightning Pro work truck and I can own for 32K and get it this summer I might still do it though. There’s some advantages to do it as a company vehicle especially if it’s something I don’t want to risk holding long term. The ‘86 F150 is waiting for parts to convert a single barrel carb to a 4 barrel carb. The carb, intake, and outflow. Had I known those parts were going to take 2 months plus to come in I probably would have just put the original carb back in. I should have that thing restored and running on a brand new rebuilt engine by spring. Once I have that for picking up plywood a little gas efficient SUV probably does make more sense.
|
|
|
Post by aquaduct on Jan 4, 2022 16:23:26 GMT -5
If I were you (for what it's worth), I'd dump the Lightning like it was hot and find a really nice gas powered little Ute like that Traverse. And hang on to that damned 6 cylinder F150 until it falls off the frame. Yeah. Kinda starting to think this way. If they offer me the Lightning Pro work truck and I can own for 32K and get it this summer I might still do it though. There’s some advantages to do it as a company vehicle especially if it’s something I don’t want to risk holding long term. The ‘86 F150 is waiting for parts to convert a single barrel carb to a 4 barrel carb. The carb, intake, and outflow. Had I known those parts were going to take 2 months plus to come in I probably would have just put the original carb back in. I should have that thing restored and running on a brand new rebuilt engine by spring. Once I have that for picking up plywood a little gas efficient SUV probably does make more sense. Well, if you didn't live in such a sucky place like Montana, maybe the parts could get there faster.
|
|
|
Post by david on Jan 4, 2022 16:53:00 GMT -5
There seems to be a crazy "grill wars" going on: The bigger, taller grill wins. Consumer Reports suggests that truck companies, Ford, GM, Ram and Toyota, have determined that it is a selling point. Of course it stupidly limits your view of the road, or big rock, in your path.
I will probably be shopping for a 1/2 ton soon and it will likely be a 4 to 10 year old 4WD truck. Maybe when all the new electric and hybrid trucks come out the price of gas trucks will drop.
|
|
|
Post by epaul on Jan 4, 2022 17:48:00 GMT -5
The Chevy Traverse is not a little SUV. Those are 20" rims 255/55R20) supporting a 120" wheel base. 4 wheel drive, that sucker will track. And will tow more than you will want to unload. And it looks just fine against those North Dakota hills! Looks like $30,000 for a 30,000 miles 2018 model is fairly typical.
|
|
|
Post by TKennedy on Jan 4, 2022 17:51:25 GMT -5
For years I have advocated for "happy" grills. When you see a huge beast bearing down on you on your mirror and it has an angry "face" you immediately judge the driver as an asshole and the first stage of road rage begins.
On the contrary if it has a happy face it changes everything.
No one could get mad at a bug eyed Sprite if their life depended on it.
Automakers have the power to end road rage.
edit: The Traverse does have kind of a happy face.
|
|
|
Post by james on Jan 4, 2022 18:00:39 GMT -5
It might just be a smug bastard. 😉
|
|
|
Post by Marty on Jan 4, 2022 19:21:25 GMT -5
I often call it a truck and it is built on a Ford Ranger frame and has the same tow package but the rest of the world calls it a SUV. Got it on a lease return and it has been the nicest vehicle I've ever had, even better than my beloved old Explorer which Billy Bob described as like driving a Lazy Boy lounger. AWD and a V6, just what I need for winter in MN and with a sun roof nice in summer. Don't need no pickup.
|
|
|
Post by majorminor on Jan 4, 2022 19:44:20 GMT -5
I often call it a truck and it is built on a Ford Ranger frame and has the same tow package but the rest of the world calls it a SUV. Got it on a lease return and it has been the nicest vehicle I've ever had, even better than my beloved old Explorer which Billy Bob described as like driving a Lazy Boy lounger. AWD and a V6, just what I need for winter in MN and with a sun roof nice in summer. Don't need no pickup. What is that Marty?
|
|