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Post by RickW on Oct 23, 2023 9:07:30 GMT -5
Rick, I get your points. We don't have to view how we treat the earth as a moral choice but I think we should. One of several reasons is that the results will affect huge numbers of other people. I also think we should hold ourselves to a higher standard than we hold pine beetles. If we're not going to do that, then I don't much care what happens to our species. We'll deserve what we get. I know, Don, and I very much agree. I’ve been feeling like me, along with much of the world, are in a pretty dark place this last little while. It’s tough to be hopeful. I mostly just try to keep busy, because too much quiet time hasn’t been good.
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Post by epaul on Oct 23, 2023 9:07:49 GMT -5
The aftermath of Ken Burn's Buffalo series isn't the best time to have a discussion concerning mankind's deeds and nature. Peter Coyote's droning voice against that unrelenting sea of human depravity and plunder had me looking for the bottom of my whisky bottle. And I'm an optimist.
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Post by epaul on Oct 23, 2023 9:17:15 GMT -5
There is enough about us to paint any picture.
I'm reminded of something Casper told me once. He said inside of each human there are two dogs. One is a dumb ugly, greedy Goldendoodle, the other is a handsome, noble, and charitable Golden Retriever. They are fighting over the same bone. Which one will win? The one you pet.
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Post by epaul on Oct 23, 2023 9:22:11 GMT -5
Bottom line, yes, we've done a lot that, but we've also done a lot of this. And we aren't done doing either that or this. But, let's strive to do more of this than that. And then we and planet will be at least ok.
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Post by Cornflake on Oct 23, 2023 9:34:26 GMT -5
These are the times that try men's souls. And women's souls. And maybe the souls of golden retrievers. The pine beetles probably remain unruffled.
I think we should do what we reasonably can and hope for the best, regardless of what we expect.
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Post by millring on Oct 24, 2023 6:30:12 GMT -5
You're right. Few people know who Calvin was, much less understand his assertions about humanity. It wasn't a useful comparison in present company. Besides, epaul is making the point I was trying to make brilliantly. Some of us know who Calvin was (and luthier Luther too). In spite of their legacies, they were not nice people. 1. Depending heavily upon who you read and who you believe. 2. It is still possible for bad people to offer something worthwhile. Generally, those posing that "Luther and Calvin were bad people" are suggesting otherwise and hoping people will accept that. I think that picking apart the thoughts expressed by men whose outlook was formed in the 16th century and based on inherited tribal wisdom and experience is both a waste of time and a purposeful, intentional misunderstanding of the ideas they were trying to express. 3. You're making my point about the rejection of Calvin.
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Post by Cornflake on Oct 24, 2023 7:23:36 GMT -5
"The aftermath of Ken Burn's Buffalo series isn't the best time to have a discussion concerning mankind's deeds and nature. Peter Coyote's droning voice against that unrelenting sea of human depravity and plunder had me looking for the bottom of my whisky bottle." When we look at history we all become Monday-morning quarterbacks.
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Post by Marshall on Oct 24, 2023 7:41:46 GMT -5
How about that Tyson Bagent and the Bears ! ! !
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Post by howard lee on Oct 25, 2023 6:29:47 GMT -5
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Post by Marshall on Oct 26, 2023 11:04:12 GMT -5
I taped the series and started watching last night. Very lloooooooooooooong and slow moving. Interesting, but slightly boring. Sad for sure.
I did like all the western paintings. Stunning.
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Post by Marshall on Oct 26, 2023 11:14:31 GMT -5
Another thing. At the time of the Civil War, the nation was a population of 30 Million. Probably not counting Native Americans. But now we are 330 Million.
The Buffalo's days were numbered, under any scenario.
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Post by John B on Oct 26, 2023 11:52:38 GMT -5
Very lloooooooooooooong and slow moving. Interesting, but slightly boring. (Ahem. Ken Burns.)
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Post by Marshall on Oct 27, 2023 8:24:35 GMT -5
I finished episode 1 last night. Pretty devastating what the buffalo hide hunters did. Just amazing and sad.
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Post by millring on Nov 9, 2023 19:33:52 GMT -5
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Post by Cosmic Wonder on Nov 9, 2023 20:05:24 GMT -5
Costco has ground bison in the meat case. I think Buffalo burgers are in my future.
Mike
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Post by epaul on Nov 9, 2023 20:14:25 GMT -5
Thank God for the Snake.
But for that trickster, we would still be what were once were, wandering idiots adrift in the garden, unclothed and blind to all but immediate need, just another animal lost in nature, unaware and incapable of choice, consequence, will, desire, failure, accomplishment, hate, love... and thought.
(Not that dogs can't have a pretty good life, but of those that do, it is because when we left the garden, we took them with us.)
Odd that a certain faith would take a story celebrating the birth of mankind and use it to laden with guilt.
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Post by millring on Nov 10, 2023 5:57:55 GMT -5
Ah, to have all that good stuff without all the pain, suffering, and death that goes with it.
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Post by Cornflake on Nov 10, 2023 7:40:18 GMT -5
"Odd that a certain faith would take a story celebrating the birth of mankind and use it to laden with guilt."
I don't find the Garden of Eden story odd. We've just been through the creation story. A loving God created everything that exists and it's all good. It would be natural for people hearing the creation story to think: when I look around it's not all good. If God loves us and made this world, why are people hurting and hungry? Why are there mosquitoes and terrorists? So Genesis provides an answer. God didn't screw up, humans did, and that accounts for all that is subpar.
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Post by John B on Nov 10, 2023 8:43:32 GMT -5
In other news, it's National Bison Week, and in honor of that my friend Bill K is offering 15% off any order, with free shipping. I decided to update my wallet (currently a nice Italian jobbie my mom got me as a souvenir of her trip to follow Paul through Italy). I also bought a little coin purse because I could also keep picks in it. Coupon code: Bisonweek23 buffalobillfoldcompany.com/c/leather/I'll get a guitar strap during the next sale.
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Post by Marshall on Nov 10, 2023 10:18:51 GMT -5
"Odd that a certain faith would take a story celebrating the birth of mankind and use it to laden with guilt." I don't find the Garden of Eden story odd. We've just been through the creation story. A loving God created everything that exists and it's all good. It would be natural for people hearing the creation story to think: when I look around it's not all good. If God loves us and made this world, why are people hurting and hungry? Why are there mosquitoes and terrorists? So Genesis provides an answer. God didn't screw up, humans did, and that accounts for all that is subpar. Humans made mosquitos? I never knew that.
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