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Post by aquaduct on Oct 30, 2023 11:37:30 GMT -5
So what are we up to now?
3 of the forum Democrats who, quite charitably voted for a Republican back in the 70s or 80s.
That proves everything John said wrong. Sorry John.
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Post by coachdoc on Oct 30, 2023 11:51:48 GMT -5
Also, in our town elections the local candidates are not posted with a party affiliation.
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Post by Russell Letson on Oct 30, 2023 12:23:10 GMT -5
Peter, which part of Minnesota's electoral history did you not understand?
BTW, I wonder whether there's a difference between an individual or population segment having a strong and persistent preference for what the Democratic Party offers and the current crop of GOP fans who loudly announce that they will never vote for a Democrat*--or their elected representatives who make it a policy matter not to work with Democrats on any legislation. Projection much?
* My maternal grandfather--the anti-Catholic bigot--quite admired Harry Truman but could not bring himself to vote for him out of party loyalty. His father, by the way, was a GOP bagman who would come back from business trips with a satchel full of cash to pay off the line of prospective voters who showed up on his back porch. Before my time, of course, but that's the family story--via my grandfather. And save the whatabouts and both-sides stuff. I'm way ahead of you--I spent a decade in Illinois.
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Dub
Administrator
I'm gettin' so the past is the only thing I can remember.
Posts: 19,863
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Post by Dub on Oct 30, 2023 12:56:12 GMT -5
So what are we up to now? 3 of the forum Democrats who, quite charitably voted for a Republican back in the 70s or 80s. That proves everything John said wrong. Sorry John. Well at least John is right about me. I’ve been a registered Democrat since my 21st birthday. I did vote for a Republican once. I voted for Charles Percy on his first run for Governor of Illinois. My first wife had become a fan and hosted a neighborhood coffee for him at our house. After meeting him and listening to him speak, I thought maybe he could clean up the mess that was the downstate Republican Party. It turned out I was wrong. I register and vote as a Democrat because I can’t vote as the Fabian Socialist I probably am. I remember a Chicago landlord of mine once explained for me the difference between Democrats and Republicans. He said they both steal, the difference being that the Democrats spread it around while the Republicans kept it all for themselves. He may have just nailed it. On edit ( 10 hours later): I lied. There was another Republican I voted for. I voted for Bob Ray when he ran for Governor of Iowa. I’d known Bob since I was a small boy. He went to our church. I used to mow his mother’s yard while he was going to law school. Plus, a dear friend, a leftist newsman from Detroit, became Bob’s campaign manager. And on this vote, I wasn’t wrong. Bob Ray was the best governor Iowa ever had.
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Post by Marshall on Oct 30, 2023 13:08:45 GMT -5
Dubyah first ran in 2000.
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Post by Russell Letson on Oct 30, 2023 13:17:56 GMT -5
I remember a Chicago landlord of mine once explained for me the difference between Democrats and Republicans. He said they both steal, the difference being that the Democrats spread it around while the Republicans kept it all for themselves. He may have just nailed it. That's a variation on my understanding of Chicago-style political corruption and graft (supplied by numerous grad-school-period Chicago friends): that people put up with corrupt ward-heelers and city councils because at least they could deliver city services. That was the deal, at least if you were white*. It dovetailed with my other bit of real-world political education from my year in Rome: that Italians realize that a bit of graft is inevitable, but that it's no reason to oppose, say, social-welfare programs. Unlike the WASPish take on poverty and misfortune as somehow sinful or at least sin-adjacent and thus to be not dealt with at all--pitch defileth and all that. * It wasn't all roses, though--I recall being advised to Never, Ever Mess With The Chicago Cops, middle-class white boy or not. 1968 confirmed that bit of wisdom.
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Post by aquaduct on Oct 30, 2023 13:30:40 GMT -5
Peter, which part of Minnesota's electoral history did you not understand? BTW, I wonder whether there's a difference between an individual or population segment having a strong and persistent preference for what the Democratic Party offers and the current crop of GOP fans who loudly announce that they will never vote for a Democrat*--or their elected representatives who make it a policy matter not to work with Democrats on any legislation. Projection much? * My maternal grandfather--the anti-Catholic bigot--quite admired Harry Truman but could not bring himself to vote for him out of party loyalty. His father, by the way, was a GOP bagman who would come back from business trips with a satchel full of cash to pay off the line of prospective voters who showed up on his back porch. Before my time, of course, but that's the family story--via my grandfather. And save the whatabouts and both-sides stuff. I'm way ahead of you--I spent a decade in Illinois. Russell, I couldn’t give less of a rip about Minnesota politics. Particularly from a half century ago. We started this talking about the current Speaker of the House. You know, the Federal government. Have no idea how that wound up in your grandfather's anti-Catholic Minnesota whatever. I'm just really looking forward to Trump's Supreme Court blowing up much of what's wrong in the Federal government currently and hearing the Democratic (as well as a sizeable chunk of the Republican party) wailing and gnashing of teeth when that happens.
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Dub
Administrator
I'm gettin' so the past is the only thing I can remember.
Posts: 19,863
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Post by Dub on Oct 30, 2023 13:39:48 GMT -5
I remember a Chicago landlord of mine once explained for me the difference between Democrats and Republicans. He said they both steal, the difference being that the Democrats spread it around while the Republicans kept it all for themselves. He may have just nailed it. That's a variation on my understanding of Chicago-style political corruption and graft (supplied by numerous grad-school-period Chicago friends): that people put up with corrupt ward-heelers and city councils because at least they could deliver city services. That was the deal, at least if you were white*. It dovetailed with my other bit of real-world political education from my year in Rome: that Italians realize that a bit of graft is inevitable, but that it's no reason to oppose, say, social-welfare programs. Unlike the WASPish take on poverty and misfortune as somehow sinful or at least sin-adjacent and thus to be not dealt with at all--pitch defileth and all that. * It wasn't all roses, though--I recall being advised to Never, Ever Mess With The Chicago Cops, middle-class white boy or not. 1968 confirmed that bit of wisdom. Exactly. During the reign of Richard J. (Hizzonner da mare) Daley, if you needed a tree by the street cut down, you didn’t call the city, you called your Democratic Ward Committeeman. He would have it quickly taken care of. Daley was both the Mayor and Chairman of the Democratic Central Committee for Cook County. A staunch Catholic, he lived in a modest brick bungalow on a working class street on the South Side. He never lived ostentatiously and evidently didn’t receive graft money directly. He’d learned that allowing a controlled level of corruption allowed him to hold great power which is what he wanted most. He also loved the city of his birth. It was the real estate interests with their redlining that forced black people into south and west side ghettos. As a result, living in a rat-infested, poorly-maintained apartment on the south side was more costly than living in a nice well-kept apartment in Rogers Park.
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Post by theevan on Oct 30, 2023 20:21:59 GMT -5
I do like his first move, insisting that Israel funding must stand alone.
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Post by theevan on Oct 30, 2023 20:22:46 GMT -5
I do like his first move, insisting that Israel funding must stand alone.
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Post by millring on Oct 31, 2023 5:03:28 GMT -5
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Post by theevan on Oct 31, 2023 9:53:59 GMT -5
Wow. I felt like I lived every single line.
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Post by james on Oct 31, 2023 13:39:18 GMT -5
Prof.Richardson wrote about Johnson and his Israel funding conditions. "The House measure, providing aid for Israel only if Democrats agree to set aside Ukraine and Gaza and permit rich people to cheat on their taxes, will set up a fight with the Senate". Richardson shares some of Karine Jean-Pierre's statement on the proposal. "“Threatening to undermine American national security unless House Republicans can help the wealthy and big corporations cheat on their taxes—which would increase the deficit—is the definition of backwards,” More at Richardson's substack - heathercoxrichardson.substack.com/p/october-30-2023
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Post by Cornflake on Oct 31, 2023 14:31:18 GMT -5
On this one, I'm with Professor Richardson. I've never understood the push to reduce funding for the IRS. It would only benefit people who cheat on their taxes. Those people are stealing from the rest of us.
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Post by theevan on Nov 1, 2023 5:51:26 GMT -5
On this one, I'm with Professor Richardson. I've never understood the push to reduce funding for the IRS. It would only benefit people who cheat on their taxes. Those people are stealing from the rest of us. Meanwhile the government steals from all of us while it spends us into oblivion. Richardson grossly mischaracterizes the intent
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Post by aquaduct on Nov 1, 2023 7:36:06 GMT -5
On this one, I'm with Professor Richardson. I've never understood the push to reduce funding for the IRS. It would only benefit people who cheat on their taxes. Those people are stealing from the rest of us. Meanwhile the government steals from all of us while it spends us into oblivion. Richardson grossly mischaracterizes the intent "The wealthy cheat on their taxes" is a time honored leftist meme that has zero evidence behind it. The wealthy hire good accountants to make sure they don't pay more than they need, but that's just playing by the rules that Congress lays out. Richardson is just a dyed in the wool progressive idiot.
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Post by majorminor on Nov 1, 2023 8:02:11 GMT -5
On this one, I'm with Professor Richardson. I've never understood the push to reduce funding for the IRS. It would only benefit people who cheat on their taxes. Those people are stealing from the rest of us. Eh. If we are speaking about Biden's push to expand the IRS it is quite literally just "more government". That's the problem not the solution.
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Post by John B on Nov 1, 2023 8:02:29 GMT -5
Meanwhile the government steals from all of us while it spends us into oblivion. Richardson grossly mischaracterizes the intent "The wealthy cheat on their taxes" is a time honored leftist meme that has zero evidence behind it. The wealthy hire good accountants to make sure they don't pay more than they need, but that's just playing by the rules that Congress lays out. Richardson is just a dyed in the wool progressive idiot. As a CPA with 30 years of experience, I call bullshit on this. I defer to you on pretty much all things automotive and Gibson electric, so I hope you can appreciate my point of view. I have lots of experience saving rich people, and rich companies, money. I spent 2 years in DC first designing tax shelters (many of which my firm rightfully rejected) then trying to make sure our ideas didn’t fall afoul of the IRS. For one client of mine, the refund they received thanks to some good tax strategies was the only check cut by Treasury that day because it was so large (think 9 digits). All of which is to say I have seen a lot. And there are massive numbers of taxpayers that go beyond strategic tax planning to outright tax fraud. At every level of income. Higher levels of income just mean the cheating is screening over more of the honest people. There is a difference between taking advantage of existing rules and abusing, twisting or downright ignoring them. I also work with enforcement agencies, federal and state, and can tell you from personal experience they are woefully underfunded and struggle to provide basic services. It would be far better if there were resources to intelligently audit, targeting the people/companies most likely to cheat, rather than auditing the easier taxpayers like you and me.
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Post by Cornflake on Nov 1, 2023 8:26:10 GMT -5
Why did I suspect that there wouldn't be unanimous agreement on this?
I think we'd be spending a little more to recoup a lot.
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Post by epaul on Nov 1, 2023 9:52:26 GMT -5
I was the most honest tax filer to ever walk this earth, but I knew this farmer next section over.... offda. He once wrote off a Stir Crazy popcorn popper by calling it a bearing washer.
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