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Post by Cornflake on Apr 22, 2020 15:01:48 GMT -5
"Could be a boom to US agriculture. We (farmers) have the ability to feed most the world. Would require governments to step up and supply aid. (print more funny money?) But it could lead to a resurgence of US dominance in the world. China can't feed itself. Russia has oil, but not enough Ag to step up to the plate. South America does pretty good. They could help."
I hope that helping with food shortages is an option, Marshall. If we come back sooner and stronger than I expect, perhaps it will be. But I think we're going to have more problems of our own than we can handle for quite a while. How I hope I'm wrong.
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Post by Marshall on Apr 22, 2020 15:06:03 GMT -5
Yes this year is going to be a crap shoot. Our food distribution system is in disarray. But the capacity is still there. With adjustments, next year could be strong for Ag.
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Post by Cosmic Wonder on Apr 22, 2020 15:31:55 GMT -5
Mean while, we just got home. I went to Costco this am to fill up the truck this morning, we got there about ten thirty. We were presently surprised by the lack of lines at the gas pumps. Pulled right up and filled it with no wait. Then we drove by the entrance to the store. No lines. Lots of shopping carts outside being cleaned by a small crew. We decided to chance going in, masked of course. The store was relatively uncrowded. We bought a hundred and fifty dollars worth of groceries and had only one person in front of us at checkout, understand this is the first time I’ve stepped into a Costco since the end of March, when lines numbering in the hundreds were constant. I’m not sure what this portends, but it reminded me of normality.
Mike
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COVID 19
Apr 22, 2020 16:01:25 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by majorminor on Apr 22, 2020 16:01:25 GMT -5
Dang it I can’t find the Reuter’s article I read this morning but it reported a small number of still quarantined early Wuhan patients are still carrying and shedding virus after several months despite being asymptotic. They might wind up being permanent carriers. Could you imagine?
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Post by jdd2 on Apr 22, 2020 16:11:01 GMT -5
(Glad I'm taking warfarin...) (and that I just got a three month supply)
Reports are saying that blood clotting is an aspect of this that is only now being recognized.
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Post by Russell Letson on Apr 22, 2020 17:52:25 GMT -5
Dang it I can’t find the Reuter’s article I read this morning but it reported a small number of still quarantined early Wuhan patients are still carrying and shedding virus after several months despite being asymptotic. They might wind up being permanent carriers. Could you imagine? It's not unprecidented--we had a cat who carried feline leukemia. She lived to be 18. Viruses have all manner of nasty tricks. (Fortunately a FeLV vaccine was developed, which allowed us to get her a roommate toward the end of her life.)
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Post by jdd2 on Apr 22, 2020 19:11:47 GMT -5
Jump to about 49:00 for the summary, and he spends about 5-6 minutes on that (then goes on to Q&A for the remainder of the video):
That was 2016, and things are tabled as things that could have caused the collapse of civilization then--1. drought, 2. famine, 3. movement of (sea) peoples, 4. havoc and cutting of trade routes.
One thing that he doesn't bring in there, that comes up in the Q&A is disease--he says there's no proof/evidence (tho absence of evidence doesn't mean it didn't happen/contribute).
He suggests that civilization then could have survived one or two of these things (maybe three?), but all of them together resulted in a collapse of the late bronze age, which, he is careful to say, didn't actually happen in 1177 BC, but over a period of time around there. A bit later he hints at comparisons to the present.
Famine has just been mentioned above, climate change/drought is being bandied about (manmade or natural), you have the havoc of recent wars (iraq, afghanistan, ME), movements of people (refugees, immigration), and now the virus, which has resulted in trade disruption--the crash in oil (like copper/tin of the ancients), falls in GDP/imports/exports, a huge pause if not an end to int'l travel. And so on.
So, something of a watershed?
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Post by Cornflake on Apr 22, 2020 21:13:11 GMT -5
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Post by Village Idiot on Apr 22, 2020 21:34:09 GMT -5
Could be a boom to US agriculture. We (farmers) have the ability to feed most the world. Would require governments to step up and supply aid. Or not. Meat packing plants are playing a large role in spreading the virus. If those shut down, farmers won't have a place to sell their livestock. They'll be in the same position as oil companies, who are running out of room to store what they've already go.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2020 4:45:12 GMT -5
Jump to about 49:00 for the summary, and he spends about 5-6 minutes on that (then goes on to Q&A for the remainder of the video): That was 2016, and things are tabled as things that could have caused the collapse of civilization then--1. drought, 2. famine, 3. movement of (sea) peoples, 4. havoc and cutting of trade routes. One thing that he doesn't bring in there, that comes up in the Q&A is disease--he says there's no proof/evidence (tho absence of evidence doesn't mean it didn't happen/contribute). He suggests that civilization then could have survived one or two of these things (maybe three?), but all of them together resulted in a collapse of the late bronze age, which, he is careful to say, didn't actually happen in 1177 BC, but over a period of time around there. A bit later he hints at comparisons to the present. Famine has just been mentioned above, climate change/drought is being bandied about (manmade or natural), you have the havoc of recent wars (iraq, afghanistan, ME), movements of people (refugees, immigration), and now the virus, which has resulted in trade disruption--the crash in oil (like copper/tin of the ancients), falls in GDP/imports/exports, a huge pause if not an end to int'l travel. And so on. So, something of a watershed? Tracing disease in the early historic or prehistoric record is tricky. Most people who die from disease die relatively quickly, and before the disease leaves any discernible markers on the skeleton, for instance. Absent a written account, archaeologists can't really note disease as a cause of death. They can, however, tell if trauma or prolonged malnutrition was a cause, evidence of which stands out in skeletal remains.
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Post by jdd2 on Apr 23, 2020 5:28:31 GMT -5
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Post by millring on Apr 23, 2020 7:05:02 GMT -5
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Post by TKennedy on Apr 23, 2020 8:13:30 GMT -5
Good article by a guy with some valid credentials that definitely makes some sense. He is a prestigious Neuroradiologist and those guys are usually real intellectuals.
As a 75 year old guy with a 75 year old immunocompromised diabetic wife I remain a little apprehensive. Mainly for my wife.
As states open up we will have even more data and hopefully it will be supportive. It is always easy to quarterback from an opinion page. If the buck stopped with the good Dr I wonder if he would have the guts to make the hard decisions.
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Post by kenlarsson on Apr 23, 2020 8:14:08 GMT -5
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Post by TKennedy on Apr 23, 2020 9:01:58 GMT -5
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Post by millring on Apr 23, 2020 9:06:56 GMT -5
I saw two very disturbing segments on the PBS News Hour last night. They are disturbing because I DON'T believe in some grand conspiracy over this virus, but it's getting harder to explain some things otherwise. The segments were:
PBS interviewed a Dr./woman who is part of a medical emergency team that arrived to help out in New York. She gave all the stock "we are overwhelmed, though in the past few days we've seen a little relief." answers. But here's the thing: they interviewed her live from the Javits Center with the "...from the Javits Center which has been set up to handle some of the overflow from the overcrowded hospitals" spoken in dire tones....but they never once mentioned that the Javits Center ended up being barely used (I found one news source that described a "trickle" of patients over the weeks it was used), but here's the even BIGGER deception: They never mentioned that she was standing in a Javits Center that had been empty for at least 3 days now -- all the medical teams had exited 3-6 days ago.
The other deception was a report on how widespread the virus seems to have been in California as early as February. Their take on it was "SEE how CONTAGIOUS this is?!" ....when the logical take should have AT LEAST been mentioned -- that that many unknown and uncounted hundreds of thousands of Californians had been infected since February and their symptoms or lack thereof were so unremarkable that the virus went undetected for at least 2, maybe 3 months. How can anyone not see that as great news? Anyone without an agenda, that is.
The orchestrated narrative has shifted profoundly too. Now that the initial virus did not meet expectations -- even as bad as New York got, they have automatically shifted to the new narrative that the "second wave" is going to be worse than the first. One reporter even said that this second wave is undeniably going to happen, and not even the slightest hint that if a second wave does indeed occur, it won't be because we "opened up" too soon, it will be because we shut down too completely in the first place..
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Post by TKennedy on Apr 23, 2020 9:35:47 GMT -5
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Dub
Administrator
I'm gettin' so the past is the only thing I can remember.
Posts: 20,336
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COVID 19
Apr 23, 2020 9:45:30 GMT -5
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Post by Dub on Apr 23, 2020 9:45:30 GMT -5
So, something of a watershed? I posted a few days ago in the reading thread that I’d come across that video. I watched the whole thing. Fascinating. I bought his book of the same title and even the audio book. The audio book is a big disappointment. It’s narrated by what sounds like a wannabe actor reading to children. Every word is inflected in some way and in ways not entirely appropriate for an educated adult audience. I too thought the parallels were at least thought provoking.
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Post by theevan on Apr 23, 2020 10:25:50 GMT -5
I saw two very disturbing segments on the PBS News Hour last night. They are disturbing because I DON'T believe in some grand conspiracy over this virus, but it's getting harder to explain some things otherwise. The segments were: PBS interviewed a Dr./woman who is part of a medical emergency team that arrived to help out in New York. She gave all the stock "we are overwhelmed, though in the past few days we've seen a little relief." answers. But here's the thing: they interviewed her live from the Javits Center with the "...from the Javits Center which has been set up to handle some of the overflow from the overcrowded hospitals" spoken in dire tones....but they never once mentioned that the Javits Center ended up being barely used (I found one news source that described a "trickle" of patients over the weeks it was used), but here's the even BIGGER deception: They never mentioned that she was standing in a Javits Center that had been empty for at least 3 days now -- all the medical teams had exited 3-6 days ago. The other deception was a report on how widespread the virus seems to have been in California as early as February. Their take on it was "SEE how CONTAGIOUS this is?!" ....when the logical take should have AT LEAST been mentioned -- that that many unknown and uncounted hundreds of thousands of Californians had been infected since February and their symptoms or lack thereof were so unremarkable that the virus went undetected for at least 2, maybe 3 months. How can anyone not see that as great news? Anyone without an agenda, that is. The orchestrated narrative has shifted profoundly too. Now that the initial virus did not meet expectations -- even as bad as New York got, they have automatically shifted to the new narrative that the "second wave" is going to be worse than the first. One reporter even said that this second wave is undeniably going to happen, and not even the slightest hint that if a second wave does indeed occur, it won't be because we "opened up" too soon, it will be because we shut down too completely in the first place.. Conspiracy? Unlikely. Getting maximum mileage out of an "emergency"? You betcha. The situation has brought out the inner totalitarian in our leaders.
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Post by james on Apr 23, 2020 10:48:17 GMT -5
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